My copy of the aired tracks is a flickery PAL->NTSC dub.
I've also obtained a version that has about 20 minutes of soundchecks (which sound a bit different EQ-wise than the rest of the tracks) in the following sequence:
"Now they're stalling, they're not automatic." "It's not, erm, what we really want." (not sure on wording) "Basically, it's just New Order, it's just us basically." And another sentence I can't make out.
BS: "Ozzie, if you can, eh, would you turn the hi-hat off the drum machine So...[rest of this sentence is obscured by instruments playing, last part could be:]...drum and the bass over..."
4. Temptation (synth) t3 0:20
5. Temptation (synth) t4 0:25 (cuts)
6. Temptation (full instrumentation, with guitar noodling at end) t5 1:40 7. Temptation (complete) t6 5:01
8. Temptation (synth + distant vox) t7 0:53 9. Temptation (complete) t8 5:20
10. Chosen Time (complete) 3:16
Then the "gig" proper, with the following tracklist. Only the first two were aired:
Barney makes a "shhh" sound after the first verse of Temptation. He also sings, "I've never met anyone as drunk as you before", I think. End cuts abruptly, next track is (quickly) faded in, which is true for the rest of the tracks in question.
Short (3:41) version.
Tribal-style drumming intro.
My copy only has about half a second of IALP before cutting, but then is faded up again and continues.
Melody Maker 30 Jan 82
Live review by Lynden Barber
Article focuses on the emerging "dance" aspect of the music. In retrospect, insightful.
Have audio that purports to be from this concert, which was tacked at the end of the the 'Riverside' 1982-01-04 tracks.
The edits are very similar to the ones done for the unaired 'Riverside' tracks, the sound is very similar, so likely done with the same equipment.
_Dreams___Never___End_ is listed first for this gig, but may or may not be present on the recording I have, as there's some question to whether the DNE belongs to the Riverside performance or this one, since the source I have of these has these gigs back to back. However, TJ pretty much settled this and DNE does appear in fact to be the first song.
Cut at 0:03, with the rest faded in.
Hooky flubs the bass intro.
Cut at 1:57, with the remainder faded in.
At about 2:49 Bernard yells "Shut up!" and whoops.
Cuts at 2:06 and sixteen seconds later, with the remainder portions faded in.
Cuts at 0:40 and two seconds later, with the remainder portions faded in. Cuts after about 75 seconds.
_Temptation_ appears on the setlist but not on what I have for the gig.
However, it was soundchecked, with the version appearing being about 1:30 long. There's some talking, mentioning the TV...and some guitar chords, followed by Hooky's bass.
A brief take of _Hurt_ follows, someone calls out Hooky's name, and then Hooky's bass makes an appearance, but the tape is cut during his vamping.
Bernard's vocals on _Temptation_ seem pretty naked.
Taper goes "Hooray", and starts tsh-tshing to the drums.
Somebody calls "C'mon Ray...c'mon, c'mon now".
_Chosen___Time_ follows. Ends in shooting noises.
_ICB_ is next.
_Senses_ and _Dreams___Never___End_ follow.
Cut after this one.
This sounds like the version that inspired Xiu Xiu's cover version, as it has Bernard singing all over the place and just the hint of xylophones.
Copy courtesy of Snotters, erm...IP Freely.
A tiny bit of garbling at the beginning.
Punter says something at 3:12 or thereabouts.
IP Freely states:
"Noteable for one of Hooky's greatest clangers - check out his playing on Ceremony! Cringeworthy!!"
I personally disagree with this assessment. Hooky was just playing it differently that time.
A bit of tuning up before _Chosen___Time_ is tackled.
Lots of knocking sounds by the syndrums.
Barney repeats a line with "if you want" or somesuch in it.
_Senses_ follows. Some audience chatter afterwards, as well as feedback squall.
The debut of this song!
Lyrics are totally different than the release
"Wherever he goes, nobody knows...
Wherever my heard goes, nobody knows..."
The "thousand islands in the sea" line is still present though.
The drums thunder...
At the end, somebody calls for "Procession".
Amazing aggro-electro opening!
And it doesn't let up.
New Order say not a word throughout.
About a minute of _Hurt_ at the start, followed by a brief foray by Hooky into the bassline of _Transmission_.
A bit of Hooky playing _From___Safety___To___Where_ bassline, and then a lot of one two'ing. Followed by a long and then short runthrough of _Temptation_, starting with an odd juxtaposition of LWTUA's bassline.
_Leave___Me___Alone_ (bass and guitar, and then instrumental) follows. This was the song's debut performance, and it sounds like the band were still practicing it. Unfortunately, the tape cuts at about a minute and a half...but a longer version is said to exist.
First part is cut.
I think this is a primitive of "When I'm With You"!
Barney tunes his guitar before starting.
The debut performance.
lyric: "Who killed my father?"
A bit of feedback afterwards.
"Move back a bit - you're pushing the stage forward. Move back. I don't mind you hurting yourselves, but don't hurt the equipment".
It's not Barney speaking, think it was Oz (from the soundcrew). Thanks to "Josef K" for the correction.
Some feedback and a bit more clamour before the Order play their next song, _In___A___Lonely___Place_.
Gillian inadvertently plays a note at 1:12.
_Hurt_ builds up slowly.
Gap in source between 4:01 and 4:03 (repeated segment probably done for A/B split), unique to the source used for this writeup.
Edit in tape.
Some talking off-mic that I can't make out, and then another edit before the final song, _Temptation_.
Source is a C90 in my collection. Sound is pretty dire, very boomy with lots of hiss...which I imagine is a problem with the actual recording.
A much better source was posted by 'tock' on DIME in April 2006, likely taped by "UK1".
Ultraviolence, The Him, Procession, Chosen Time, Dreams Never End, Senses, Temptation, Ceremony
Soundcheck (10 minutes): Leave Me Alone, Ultraviolence
The copy I have doesn't include this, but a subsequent one that's surfaced reveals that the drumming way off beat for LMA, very uncharacteristic... however it comes together once Bernard's guitar comes in. LMA wasn't performed during the gig for some reason, as it was debuted in Bristol but wouldn't be played again until 11 Mar 82.
Third time NO played this song. Opening line is "Who killed the darkness?"
Lots and lots of feedback in the second and third minutes of this song.
On the 'tock' version, taper 'heys' in approval when he hears the synth intro.
Taper or someone by him hums along. ('tock' version)
Short break between this and the next song.
The sound seems to have gotten better, though it's nowhere near good. Another short, but slightly longer, break between this and the next song.
Some instrument tuning/scales. Gets a healthy round of applause.
Has someone going "da da da da da da"...
Starts off with a couple of bass notes and a healthy dose of cheers both at the start and at the end, which is also accompanied by clapping stamping, and cries for more.
March 10th 1982 at Hull Tower Cinema, they did a 25 minute version of Ultraviolence as an encore(following a set just over the same length). One-by-one they disappeared (as did the audience)until there was nothing left but the drum machine - my how we laughed. At the end there were about 10 people left, despite this I thought they were awesome.
The local press, however, (I must scan this sometime from my yellowing page of the Hull Daily Mail) wrote it up with the heading 'Group's unique encore no joke for fans', described them as 'self-important', 'bleak' 'pretentious, noisy and generally boring', 'bleak [again] loud and depressing'.... finishing with 'some joke'.
My kind of band.
Have this on C90 (sounding about 3rd-4th generation) and from 'snotters' via STG (2nd generation).
_Everythings___Gone___Green_ has a punter comment "Fookin' hell" at about 3:27.
_Chosen___Time_ is next.
Somebody mentions Denial.
_Truth_ and _ICB_ are played.
A bit of a soundcheck and some souting out, 'Ceremony' being called out. Taper or someone close to him says something like "Party all 'round".
We get _Dreams___Never___End_ instead.
A bit of loud screaming between DME and this one, and someone near the taper addresses Eddie at the mixing desk. The band had still not said a word.
Crash edit in the tape between this one and the next tune, it sounds like.
_Denial_ follows. Folks cheer for "more" and start stamping when it's over.
Another edit in the tape, when it starts up again, it's with _Ultraviolence_ in progress. The version of it here is only 20:06, unlike the description above. It's the second time this is played. No mention of "I killed my father".
Have a couple copies of this, the best one being Snotters' M/2 that was seeded to STG in mid-2004. Both of these are from the same master. A different recording, this time from KL, turned up recently.
_In___A___Lonely___Place_, _Chosen___Time_, and _Denial_ start out the set.
The KL version has some fan chatter during the first song, more than the others.
Somebody explains "Jesus" at the end of Denial (Snotters). The opening sequencer bit to _Ultraviolence_ is aired out a couple of times before the song kicks into gear. To these ears, it sounds a lot like Video 586.
Features the "Who killed my father" lyrics and Barney cooing. Then he sings "Who killed the Irish?".
A bit of a stutter 5:23 on the KL source (source tape glitch).
If you listen closely at about 0:10 of KL's version you can hear the sound of a cash register!
Edit point (A/B) between this and the next one.
Second performance. The intro guitar work is very, very good.
This is an amazing rendition, with very different lyrics than what was released. Don't think they every topped this.
Cut in KL version at 5:30.
Another one that takes a bit of time to start up, the intro is played in a similar matter to "Ultraviolence". Somebody yells out, "What's going on?" (Snotters).
Some audience chatter at 0:50 of this. Drop out at 1:08-1:10. (Snotters version)
This version has a unique orchestral-sounding synth line (can be heard about 6:10 in).
Edit in KL version between _Procession_ and _Temptation_, which it has in reversed order.
The version of the former on KL's is muffled, according to him it was problems in the source, including a dropout 3:18 in.
Source courtesy of TJ.
"Utrecht: short and rather aggressive. Peter had been in a fight with audience members the day before in Rotterdam at the Glazen Zaal after complaints of the length of the show (30-minus minutes)."
Considering this happened nearly 20 years ago, he can be excused for a bit of chronological inaccuracy...Uterect was on 11 APR 82, and there were two gigs in between.
This is backed up by the following comment made during the 17 MAY 84 Paradiso gig, from "Jon ten Have":
...reminded them of the Rotterdam gig some years before when a big fight broke out after they had only played 20 minutes. The encore included Decades and Love will ..., it was made clear to the audience that it wasn't for them but for a friend who died some years ago."
A bit of chatter (in English, I think) at the start.
At about 3:15, somebody says "...get round the back...about the spot... don't you? etc.".
Feedback squall at 0:42 or so.
Tempo starts out slow but speeds up after a few seconds.
Feedback squall about 45 seconds in.
Some chatter from people, low in volume.
Taper: "One of my fucking knobs has just dropped off."
Associate: "Oh my God!" (probably as a jibe)
There's a bit more muttering, with somebody saying something, someone else replying "Eh?", and the first person repeating it.
_Temptation_ closes out the set, which the crowd judges as having been all too brief, as you can hear boos as the PA backing music comes back on.
Source courtesy of TJ.
A couple of mic placement/stereo fields shift during the intro. Vocals and bass ganged up on the right channel
An edit during the clapping, and Barney picks his guitar before the start of _The___Him_.
A few more 'slow' stereo shifts through the first part of this song.
Barney tunes up, and then you can hear the sound of something (I don't know what) getting dropped. A small cut about 30 seconds into this song.
A good sized break before the Order play _Temptation_. Garble in tape where Bernard sings, "A feeling inside, it's no joke." Another garble when Barney sings, "Oh you got green eyes...".
_In___A___Lonely___Place_ follows. The tape appearently has a few garbles and cuts in it here.
Cut between IALP and the next song, Ultraviolence, which has a couple of fits and starts before the band actually play it through. And a few more garbles/cuts/stereo shifts.
_Chosen___Time_ and _Procession_ follow, with _Hurt_ closing out the set. Not a single word from the band throughout.
Fairly good sounding tape. Probably a few generations off master, though. The last set with all Movement-era songs the band were to play.
New Order open the set with _ICB_.
Next up is _Procession_. A bit of audience chatter at the start (in Dutch of course).
Near silence afterwards for a few seconds until the drum machine for _Truth_ fires up.
Dutch bird talks between tracks.
The sequencer for _Hurt_ mysteriously speeds up and slows down during the intro.
_Senses_ and then _Chosen___Time_ follow, with _Denial_ being the penultimate track.
A bit of feedback during parts of _Temptation_.
Dropout at 6:13.
Description by Jan Bollansee:
"The penultimate show of the 5-date Dutch tour in April 1982, captured by at least two tapers. Tracks 1-3 are from an audience recording that starts out as a 7+ but improves to 8+ by Ceremony. From track 4 onwards, the source is a superior audience recording that unfortunately cuts in during the intro to Dreams Never End; presumably this taper arrived a little late at the venue? Anyway, our favourite taciturn band delivers (races through) another great performance, including an early rendition of Leave Me Alone and a 15-minute exploration of 'Cramp'. Check it out!
This recording, another low-gen gem, once more comes courtesy of TJ. No recording seems to circulate of the last night in Holland, on the 12th of April at the Staargebouw in Maastricht, so it's off to Belgium after this!"
False start at beginning.
Band tune up afterwards, and you can hear someone loudly talking at the start of _The___Him_.
Something rare, a drum misfire by Morris at about 3:10.
Song concludes with Hooky's bass, and more tuning, a small edit, and then yet more tuning.
Different source used for _Dreams___Never___End_, which is cut.
_Senses_ follows on the heels of DNE.
Hooky tunes at the end of this song.
Bass solo starts out a bit shaky, and a bit in the wrong key. But otherwise, a solid rendition.
_Denial_ and _Everythings___Gone___Green_ follow.
Then follows a fourteen-and-a-half workout called _Hurt_ to close things out.
Description by Jan Bollansee:
"The first of two consecutive nights in Belgium, after the 5-date Dutch tour. The Lido club being an acoustic hell, this is far from a clear audience recording - though another low-gen tape from the cornucopia otherwise known as TJ's vault, this is easily the poorest of the extant tapes of the entire European Spring tour of '82. Still, it has its worth as this gig saw the debut performance of 'The Village'. Unfortunately, the encore of Temptation & Ultraviolence is missing.
Bit of a strange intro to this. Recording starts in progress...into what ends up being a false start.
The next three songs are played straight through.
Debut of _The___Village_.
Cut between _Dreams___Never___End_ and _Senses_.
First source was a set of MP3 files downloaded from the net, which may have originated from a vinyl LP, though it's hard to tell since there's very few (if any) pops or crackles.
Snotters then posted these to STG, from a 2nd gen tape, likely the same source as the above.
This is a superb performance.
The debut performance. I suspect they never topped it.
Extraordinarily good instrumentation here, especially the interplay between guitar and bass, helped by the reverb.
"It is absolutely fantastic, some of New Order's best ever guitar interplaying as well, all those descending chord configurations.
"Searching for the darkness,
searching for the darkness,
Cut below the headlights
Cut below the headlights
At the old casbah in Cairo x 4
Burnt by the sunshine
Burnt by the sunshine
Keeled to the floor
Keeled to the ground
At the old casbah in Cairo..."
'Rock The Casbah' this is not.
About 25 seconds of silence where the fans chatter in their native tongue.
_Ceremony_ has a punter (in the audience, left channel) singing the lyrics along with Bernard, but because Sumner's vocals don't come in immediately, the punter sounds like he's doing very quiet backing vox. Brief drop at about 2:35.
Some talking during the intro of _Dreams___Never___End_.
_Hurt_ features a chattery keyboard line.
_Ultraviolence_ is faded in, and there's a bit of mic scuffling in the first few seconds. The programmed synth sounds a lot like 586's. This is another "Who killed my father?" variation.
At some point I should write up the lyrics for this version.
Another longish-gap between _Chosen___Time_ and _Senses_ filled with ponging synthetics.
Somebody calls out "All right" at the start of _Everythings___Gone___Green. Different stuttering synths at the 4:30ish mark. Brief dropouts at 8:20 or so.
The levels drop a bit during _Temptation_. The echo at the end sounds artifically induced, whatever that means.
Have this on CD courtesy of Brian G. Sound quality is outstanding, as the source is an FM broadcast, easily equalling or surpassing Taras. Even better is a version provided by TS.
The setlist given by Waterrat was as follows:
Temptation, Chosen Time, Truth, Hurt, In A Lonely Place, The Village, Denial, Procession, Ceremony
However, it seems that at least some FM copies of the gig, have has IALP as the first tune, not the fifth. There are edits between most, if not all, of the FM songs, so it's hard to tell sequencing.
TJ reports that the audience copy has IALP between Hurt and The Village. The audience version naturally does not feature breaks or gaps between tracks. However, he later realized that his copy did have the last 20 seconds of IALP at the beginning, so it *is* indeed the first song of the set.
So the proper setlist is:
In A Lonely Place, Temptation, Chosen Time, Truth, Hurt, The Village, Denial, Procession, Ceremony
The version of this performance on the New Order Anthologies has Truth and Hurt's titles mixed up. The songs are in the exact same order as the original Waterrat listing.
The sixth song in my CD is "Leave Me Alone", but this sounds like it was taken from an LP, with crackling, so this is likely an interpolation from an unknown performance. Likewise with the last song, which is ICB, and a cracking version too.
Bernard includes an additional verse with the last two lines the same as "the hangman..." verse, but with the first two lines as follows:
"A light that shines down from above/A light that is guided by love"
Like the previous song, the vocals aren't turned up until the second line.
The drum machine seems to have a mind of its own during the intro. Outro transition between this and the next song is a bit rough, perhaps to edit out the broadcaster.
Hooky plays a somewhat different riff starting at 1:58. This version goes past 2:30 before Bernard starts vocals. There's some volume fluctuations on the TS version at about 1:30.
This live version, like some others includes the "Let me take you... anywhere you want." lyric. Drum break at about 4:30-ish.
Second time ever that this song is played live. Hooky says something in the first few seconds that I can't make out.
Bass synth riff slightly different than on PCL.
Significant difference in lyrics as well, with the following highlights:
"Our love is like the flowers, the trees, the birds and the sea"
"Our love is like death on ice and our love cease to be"
Song is greeted to more applause than any other song to this point.
The intro blazes, and the pace doesn't let up. Outstanding.
Even more applause.
High pitched bass pluck at 0:10 in. Another fast one. Song ends with synth wash and guitar.
Wow, this is the fastest I've ever heard the Order perform this one.
Here follow notes on the songs that I believe are interpolations.
_Leave Me Alone_
Definitely sourced from elsewhere, due to the increase in surface noise consistent with an LP dub. Barney's opening riff is slightly off. Vocals start at 1:23.
Very bass/drum-dominated mix, with some amp buzzing. This one sounds more closely in line with the Paris gig, but the vocals sound different, more consistent with his later style.
Fairly good-sounding audience version.
A bum note during the intro to _Ceremony_, not that easy to spot. _The___Him_ follows. A bit of tuning between this one and _Denial_...or is it Chosen Time, since Barney mistakenly plays the opening riff to that song...
Some punter chatter before the start of _Temptation_. It's in Dutch, so not much chance of a transcription.
"Woo, woo, woo, woo" at the end I *do* understand.
A couple of pauses during the intro bits to _Ultraviolence_. This version bass synth sounds similar to the one on "Video 586".
_Chosen___Time_ and _Procession_ follow. Some more tuning after that track, and then an edit.
_Hurt_ rounds out the set.
There's a dropout at 5:37, with the sound coming back at a lower volume. The ending to this is quite interesting. Folks clap and whistle as this fades out.
Thanks to Jan Bollansee for clarifying some of the confusion regarding the sources available for this gig.
Have a tape that appears to be a dub from a boot CD labelled "Dreams Never End". However, this isn't the 3xLP of a couple of their '81 German gigs, but something completely different. Jan says that this issue (11 tracks) was done by the same people who released the 'Dead Bodies Can't Sing' and 'Ceremony' bootleg CDs, all of which were just sourced from prior bootleg LPs.
Here's the songlist of the DNE CD:
Hurt (faded out mid-song)
Dreams Never End
Here's what I had originally written:
The first 5 songs are exactly the same as Pennies, Norwich 24 May 82, but the sequence of the last six songs don't match anything else listed.
Now, the only England '82 gig listed which doesn't have a track listing is Kilburn National Ballroom, London 05 May 82. What's weird is that Kilburn is listed again as having happened on 25 MAY 82.
I now believe that the 05 MAY 82 entry for Kilburn is probably bogus. The other tracks (thanks to Waterrat's documentation) are taken from the 21 JUN 82 Palasport Italy (586/Denial/Dreams Never End) and 19 SEP 82 Athens performance (Truth/Senses/Temptation). [this assumption is likely incorrect]
Actually, I have another tape of this gig, also taken from LP which has the same running order up to Hurt (as well as the fade) but then 586, Denial, and Everything's Gone Green. I haven't verified whether 586 and Denial are the same Palasport tracks as the DNE/England 82 boot, and I have no idea where EGG comes from.
"As it happens, the first seven tracks of the 'DNE' CD come straight from the 'Long Farewell to Your Soul' bootleg (including the faded-out 'Hurt', which is at the end of side one of the LP). The four remaining tracks are from another vinyl bootleg I have, which documents the Florence '82 gig (and not Bologna & Athens, as you presume).
Then, you turn to a 'different' source for Norwich, from 'another' bootleg LP. In that instance, you actually give a complete description of the 'Long Farewell' LP, which closes with Denial, Grace Jones' Walking In The Rain and then the final encore of 'Everything's Gone Green'. I suspect that the latter track wasn't copied onto the 'DNE' CD because the intro is pretty garbled at the point where Bernard comes in on the guitar."
Of course, if you go by the labels listed on the cover, and by extention, on the WiM site:
...you'd be fooled into thinking those tracks appeared on and/or in the order actually plated. Jan again:
"I've finally done the proper thing and taken out the vinyl bootleg. Presto, the mystery is solved: the tracklisting on the back cover says "Denial/EGG/We All Stand" (see scan), but I can definitely, 100% guarantee that that is not what is on the disc. It's just another case of bootleggers messing up the tracklisting on their product. The fact that the 'Procession' 2xLP lists the same sequence only goes to show that it is based on the "ALFTYS" set (as well as another 83 show). Oh, and now we also know that David Sultan doesn't listen to his bootlegs ;-) ."
And TJ digs out his audience tape copy and sees the setlist is actually:
Ultraviolence/Procession/ICB/Chosen Time/Hurt/Denial/EGG/We All Stand//586
I'm inclinded to believe this was the actual setlist. And this has been confirmed. I'm not sure if TJ's audience copy is the same source as the bootleg...
Sequencer pattern is similar to Prime 586. There's a bit of a guitar solo in this one too.
lyric: "Hit me hard..."
After _ICB_, fan yells out something loudly, which I can't make out.
A bit of chatter during the _Hurt_ intro, after which somebody cheers. Mostly consisting of a female saying "No".
After all these years, the missing _We___All___Stand_ has surfaced. Quite an interesting exploration. Maybe not appreciated by the bloke who yelled out "Wake up, you bastards!"
The gig ends with the debut of _586_. The knowledgable among New Order fanatics say that the best live performance of any of their songs is typically their first.
Certainly a case can be made for this version.
And this tidbit from Jan Bollansee:
"I always find it fascinating to hear which songs were played before and after gigs... adds a lot to the atmosphere! Like Grace Jones' Walking In The Rain being played right after the debut performance of 586 in Norwich."
Bernard's playing the chords of the Iggy Pop tune, as one of the punters comments.
There's some talking as Hooky plays the bassline to _586_ and _From___Safety___To___Where_. Followed by a full _586_ take, and then a bit of _The___Village_ bass and a touch of melodica, as well has _Hooky_ 1-2'ing.
Two takes of _Hurt_ follow this, the second featuring the bassline to _Cries___And___Whispers.
Then you can hear a lady's voice at the end.
Melody Maker 5 Jun 82
Live review by Lynden Barber
Positive review, however the reviewer wasn't all that excited about New Order's jam with 52nd Street 30 minutes after their proper set.
"You talk too much."
-Hooky addresses some punters
National Ballroom, Kilburn, 25 May 1982 (taken from Adam "Aleph" Gardner's signature)
Writeup, from a CD courtesy of Solitude.
Second time this is played.
Hooky hits a few bum notes here, but otherwise it's the early version that some judge to be better than the one that ended up on PC&L.
lyric: "I see bloodshed in my skin..."
Great ending. Big songs...
Some audience chatter in between.
Extended drum intro...
Somebody yells, "You fuck off." Quite a bit of shouting amongst different groups of punters, enough to get Hooky to state to the crowd, "You talk too much."
lyric: "Who saw the darkness?...Who saw the blind heat?"
At the end a fan comments, "turn the vocals up!"
Loud cheering when the synths of _Processions_ come on.
Somebody calls out for "Dreams Never End", punter closer to the taper comments "you _still_ talk too much". New Order tune their instruments, as somebody else says "Play something new."
Audience comment at end, "Nice one".
PH: "[can't make out], wash your tongues...You're not shouting anything. That's all."
Punter yells out, "Cheer up, Peter!" and Hooky then replies, "That's better."
A fabulous version.
Tape edit (actually two) at this point.
More tuning afterwards. Someone cries out for EGG.
Intro sounds like Everything's Gone Green, but then shifts...
Rapt applause and shouts for "More!", of course.
Squealing tape edit...
Definitely unlike anything I've heard from the group before or since. Somebody from 52nd St. can be heard to shout out "Poison", which I think is the name of the track. Ends in feedback.
Juha submitted the following:
Provinssirock, Seinajoki, Finland
6th of June 1982
2. The Him
5. We All Stand
6. Dreams Never End
No encores. No 'The Passenger' played, despite what Mark Johnson claimed.
Another possibility is that this was played just during the soundcheck, as they've played the guitar riff at least at other coundchecks.
"My friend recorded the set with his portable radio cassette recorder from the soundboad tower in the field. Throughout the set there was some static noise - possibly caused by a bad cable of the PA system - which got progressively worse as the gig went on, up to the point of 'We All Stand', where from there it cleared up somewhat."
His first impression of the performance:
A mild let down. They were kinda lost, awkwardly looking at their shoes. One highlight was Hooky's over the top stage presence."
Then he writes:
"Now that I listened the tape few times New Order actually was playing quite tightly and sounded great according to the laws of NO physics. No major fuck-ups at all. Guitars mostly in tune, just a little bit of annoying in-the-middle-of-the-song tuning. The most distinctive element of their music - Hooky's bass playing - was in its place and brilliant.
The tunes are stripped-down compared to the originals, yet contain the essense of the recorded versions. Hooky was singing 'Dreams Never End', with Barney doing the rest. No "hello-we-are-a-band-you-must-be-the-audience" babble. Not even a single song title. Not a word. I don't remember they said an extra word during the whole gig to communicate with the audience. Super cool!"
Juha reckons that the tape rates as A-/B+, if it weren't for the static hiss that can be heard throughout. I say it's definitely A-. He also notes that the version of Ultraviolence on this was quite short, nothing like the 20+ minute opus heard elsewhere around this time. While the weather conditions, equipment problems, and band mindset perhaps resulted in a sub-par show, what we hear of New Order on tape belies Juha's initial impressions.
He then adds:
"I'm pretty sure there was some long tuning breaks. According to the tape it sounds like recording was paused during the band was tuning and struckling with their equipment. Not any significant loss, really. Annoying, but not too bad though."
"Ultraviolence' is app. 3 min. long. Is it really that short? I feel like there's a bit more than few seconds missing. I don't know. Hmm... makes me wonder. There's nice version of 'We All Stand' - kinda reggae sound system echo used in it. Overall the tunes eventually released in their 2nd album are in their early stage or just rawer, down stripped live versions." 586 in particular is a highlight, in it's "Taboo #7" form.
Some additional comments from Juha, regarding the rarity of the recording and more information regarding the atmosphere of the gig:
"You are possibly quite right. This tape of mine has never been out in any circulation whatsoever. It's quite possibly there are only two copies in existence - I made one extra safety copy of it to myself. If I ever made one for my friend - the recording engineer - it's most likely lost or destroyed. I don't remember if I'd made a copy for the third friend who participated at Provinssi. So there're max. 3 copies in existence nowadays, but not very likely - most likely only these two I have. Until now...
The Finnish personnel involved seemed to be somewhat indifferent. Who knows? There might be some (most likely a cassette, as DAT wasn't available back then) SBD existing - capturing all that static interference crystal clear! But this is most definitely the best audience recording made from this show - if any other exist - not because of the hi-tech gear used all the way through the process but the location it was recorded from. You simply cannot beat a soundboard/control tower that easily! And those days it wasn't that common people had recordable gear of any kind with them. Who can tell?
I doubt even NO/personnel involved have any recollection of that catastrophic experience/bad memory. According to my friend there was NO interview in some news/musicpaper. They were asked what they remembered from that gig in Provinssi. They said something about dismal/dready experience, possibly referring to a chilly and rainy day which may have had something to do with causing the sound problems (synths/sequencers being very sensitive to humidity) - not long before before NO started, the sun started to shine - and muddy, out of their head drunken kids, crazy ordinary Finnish citizens all over the place. Which is, by the way, a beautiful park; full of trees and green grass with a small lake and all."
Another question was the exact date. Juha had questioned whether the performance occured on Saturday, June 5th as opposed to Sunday, June 6th (which is what the various official sources had given), but it turns out that his recollection was a bit hazy and that the gig had indeed happened on Sunday, as the weather that day had been clear for a part of the day rather than completely rainy as it was for the previous day, which matches up what had been reported for their performance.
Also, according to SOUNDI 7/82 Pauli Kosonen's festival report and Thomas Harald in the VASABLADET newspaper, 'Everything's Gone Green' was played. Considering the recording was paused twice, it's not inconceivable that this song was not taped. But according to the taper, no such thing happened, and the journalist simply misidentified one of the tracks, in my estimation, most likely 586, since it was a very new song and to the casual observer (or lazy journalist), may have resembled Everything's Gone Green, and that one source passed it onto the other.
A transcription of the crowd banter. New Order do not speak at all thoughout.
Due to my inability to render non-ASCII characters, "x" is used for "a" with an umlaut, and "z" is used for "o" with the same.
1:17: "Vai pitiks jxtkix nxhdx?"
TRNS: "So this group (New Order) is a must-see?"
(addressing Juha's friend.)
(Juha's friend's initial response.)
The initial person repeats his question, with no audible immediate response. A little bit later, there's the following.
2:01: "Hei Sviikki!"
TRNS: "Hey, Sviikki!"
2:03: "Kuka ne o?"
TRNS: "Who are they?
2:04: "New Order?"
2:05: "New Order? Jaha."
TRNS: "New Order? Yup."
2:31: "Ootteko te kaverit ton txnne pxxstxnyt?" TRNS: "Did you guys let him in here?"
(Probably referring to the taper who had mounted the control tower for the taping.)
4:30: "Yks kundi toi noi."
TRNS: "Some guy brought those.
(Pointing out the recording gear of the friend of Juha's.)
4.33: "Yks kundi toi noi. Mx annoin xxnittxx sen." TRNS: "Some guy brought those. I let him record."
4:37: "Et kovin suurta lzytxnyt?"
TRNS: "Couldn't find anything bigger?"
(A sarcastic/amused comment about the recording gear being not so big addressed to Juha's friend.)
(This is somebody else besides the taper replying.)
7:03: "Hirvee jyrinx!"
TRNS: "Terrible rumble!
A few seconds later, the same person asks:
7:06: "Mistxhxn se johtuu?"
TRNS: "What might be causing it?"
(about the buzzing)
7:08: "Voi olla et niillx o joku piuha poikki. Ei se pxivxllx ottanut yhtxxn."
TRNS: "It may be they have some cable cut. It didn't cause any (interference) earlier today."
0:12: "Ota valot kokonaan pois."
TRNS: "Turn the lights completely off."
2:51: "Siellx ei oo valoja mihin mx pyrin." TRNS: "There're no lights that I can get connected. That's what I'm doing here."
2:54: "Txx tulee pois."
TRNS: "This one is an output".
2:57: "Kokeile Tuomas valomiehix."
TRNS: "Tuomas, try out the lighting crew."
TRNS: "The lighting crew!"
3:00: "Koko ajan."
TRNS: "All the time."
(Tuomas sounds annoyed because he *has* been working on contacting the lighting crew)
3:02: "Hei valot! Onks valomiehix?"
TRNS: "Hey lights! Any lighting crew?
(this is 'Tuomas' talking over a command line between the control tower and lighting crew)
3:10: "Otit sx kaikki jo pois?"
TRNS: "Did you turn 'em off yet?"
3:12: "Onks nxx valoja?"
TRNS: "Are these the lights?"
(probably referring to the switches)
3:18: "Koko ajan ollu pois."
TRNS: "Been off all the time."
3:28: "Ai kokonaan?"
TRNS: "All of them off?"
4:28: "Jep. Niil on lxhtz kunnossa."
TRNS: "Yep. They've got the output in order.
4:30: "Oikee otto pxxllx?"
TRNS: "Correct input on?"
4:33: "Ei aavistustakaan."
TRNS: "Not the slightest clue."
4:34: "Siis mitx?"
TRNS: "Say what?"
4:42: "Ei ollu pxxllx vai?"
TRNS: "So it wasn't on, right?"
6:31: "Lopettais nyt jo saatana! Txx on huono avaus." TRNS: "Can't they just fucking stop? This is a bad start."
(Juha notes that this person's probably more worried about the rest of the weekend than about New Order's particular performance. This pro isn't a particularly happy camper right about now)
6:48: "Varos vxhx sitx."
TRNS: "Watch out for that one."
7:03: "Pitiks sun tarttua?"
TRNS: "Did you have to grab that?"
(Juha doesn't have the slightest idea what this was about.)
0:02: "Aika hyvx."
TRNS: "Pretty good."
(probably about the quality of the sound. No indication that he's being sarcastic here)
0:04: "Ei se vaan sekxxn. Ei se valoon voinu saada ainoastaan." TRNS: "It wasn't even that one. It couldn't have leaked into just the lights."
0:08: "Aika hoopoja ne ottaa."
TRNS: "Pretty goofy ones they let on."
(Possibly about the dubious, in this person's opinion, choice of letting New Order play in this festival.)
0:09: "Ei txtx jumalatkaan kestxis."
TRNS: "Not even the Gods could endure this."
(His counterpart is less harsh towards the band.)
0:12: "Toiki on hyvx ehkx jossain mielessx." TRNS: "Maybe even that (New Order) is good in some sense."
0:16: "Se kikkaili noilla pelleillx, nii se ei ollu hyvx." TRNS: "He was messing around with the cymbals so that they would sound bad."
(probably directed at to whoever soundchecked the drums, since in this person's view, they didn't do a very good job)
0:19: "Tosi xhellys."
TRNS: "Real toiling."
0:20: "Se oli hirveetx."
TRNS: "It was terrible."
0:21: "Joo mx kuulin sen nii kauhea xhellys." TRNS: "Yeah, I heard it so it was like terrible toiling."
0:24: "Sit siellx oli enemmxnki niitx." TRNS: "Then there're some more of them."
3:39: "Lopeta nyt jo."
TRNS: "Stop now already."
3:55: "Se kundi lxhti pois?"
TRNS: "That guy went away?"
3:56: "Joo. Aikoja sitten."
TRNS: "Yeah. A long time ago."
3:57: "Se xijx hxvis."
TRNS: "That geezer disappeared."
4:03: "Ja lisxx vaan txllxstx."
TRNS: "An' some more of this."
(being totally sarcastic)
M/2 cassette seeded by davemings. Very good quality, taken from LP bootleg, all tracks fade in and out.
Feedback squall at start.
_586_ and _Procession_ follows.
Then about 35 seconds of the intro to _Ultraviolence_.
BS: "Guilty request there." (not sure if this is what he says)
The band then play _Chosen___Time_.
Audience stop and clap between songs, and during the intro of _Truth_.
We hear a second or so, and then there's a tape edit and it starts over. Not sure if that's on the original vinyl or not.
_Ultraviolence_ starts out at too-high a pitch, which give it its own unique identity. Excellent version.
At 4:18 there's this amazing sequencer pattern, much more aggressive than is wont for this song.
_Temptation_ ends the proceedings.
Copy from PA. A somewhat hissy but still enjoyable audience tape, as this is quite a good recording.
A bit of PA bumpiness at the start.
Still with the "who killed my father" lyrics.
Folks clap and cheer through the break.
The bass sequencer falters at points.
The first verse of this song still doesn't have the final lyrics as they appear on PC&L.
New Order tune after the completion of this song. A bloke calls out something that sounds like "Barney", but is probably Italian.
Hooky plays the opening riff completely out of key.
The sound characteristics changes between 5:01 - 5:08, as if this source has been patched.
One lyric is "You must be joking".
BS: "Buenos aries."
BS: "No, it's not working. Push it." (or does he say "bullshit"?)
BS: "I might need some help anywhere these days." (last part uncertain)
New Order accidentally fire off the wrong sequencer program. (Hurt's instead of Temptation's)
BS: "[few words] is dead."
_Dreams___Never___End_ follows, with some seconds of 'dead air', and then _Denial_.
BS: "Thank you very much."
Squiggly-sounding tape edit. Hooky playing unique bass riff that speeds up into the amazing early rendition of 586. This one is about 10:30 in length.
A fairly-odd sounding one sound-wise...volume levels are all over the place...maybe be due to excessive NR, as my copy sounds fairly metallic.
_In___A___Lonely___Place_ and _Dreams___Never___End_ first.
Some near audience comments (in Italian) during the intro of _Chosen___Time_.
Powerful version of _The___Him_.
A bit of feedback and tuning after this, as well as quite a bit of chatter.
Bernard scraps his guitar pick across his strings.
Girl calls out for "Sarahmonee" between tracks.
_The___Village_ follows. This is the only non Movement-era track they performed that night.
_Denial_ sounds especially garbled here.
More loud shouting at the end of this.
Amusing singalong to _Temptation_, with a few screaming out the name of the title. There's a break about a minute in, and lots of screaming near the end, some of it for "Barney".
Taken from a bootleg LP, most likely the "Bologna 06/21/82" double LP issue. I'm now of the opinion that this is sourced from a an excellent-quality audience tape rather than a soundboard, as the kick drum/cymbals are more echoey than what you would get with a soundboard and there is near audience banter that can be heard in between the second and third songs.
_Temptation_ and _Procession_ start out the set. There's a fairly long gap between those and _We___All___Stand_.
Solid version of the Movement classic.
This version starts off with a repeated Hooky bass note, and a sequencer pattern close to, but not quite the same, as the one on Video 586.
Fade between 586 and _Hurt_.
The bass riff at some point on this goes deliciously off-key.
BS: "Thanks very much. We love Italy as well."
Lyrics are still not in their final form. A beautiful rendition.
"It goes up, it goes down, it touches the ground."
"Oh, this day is like the time, it comes behind...out our behind. This day is like the tide, it hurts me, it hurts me, it hurts me, it hurts me, I buy it, I'll buy it."
"The starlight is beautiful, the sky is quite nice too." "The starlight is beautiful, the sky, babe(?), is okay."
Any help in finalizing these lyrics would be most appreciated.
Edit between The Village and _Denial_, which segues neatly into _Dreams___Never___End_. _Ceremony_ and a very strong _In___A___Lonely___Place_ finish out the set. Actually, all the tracks are strong, this is a worthy mate to the Milan gig the day after.
Original text for this entry (not very accurately) read:
"Tracks 6-8 of the second 'Dreams Never End' boot are taken from this performance. There's no audience banter to speak of, but sound quality is very good, having originated as a soundboard recording."
CD from Solitude. Source is soundboard, sound is excellent. Have another version from TS with even better sound, though more hiss and less NR.
Fade-in. Crackling 8-9s in.
Barney tunes up as Gillian plays intro.
A bit more tuning before the Order play _Chosen___Time_ Bernard's vocals start up low in the mix.
Barney says something (off-mic, impossible to make out) and changes guitars (you can hear him unplug/plug).
"Taken from a killing ground" line repeated. Hooky's backing vocals are fairly notable, as they're somewhat off-key.
Break in the TS version between the tracks.
Seventh time they play this one. Interesting version, not the best playing, but worth paying attention to.
Bernard's guitar tone is different than it should be, and he's a bit off with respect to a few of the notes and playing in time to Gillian. Gillian's guitar is left speaker, Bernard's is right, as left guitar keeps playing as Barney sings.
The lyrics are a bit different. Open "thousand islands" line is awash in reverb.
lyrics: "They are favorite sayings(?) from head to toe, it's the same. There are a thousand bad dreams in the night, I've seen a thousand bloodless, sleepless fights..."
"There is [three words starting with 't'] on the horizon..."
The ending guitar salvos are somewhat different than the release.
About 2:00 the tape on the Sol version garbles as the heads run over a stretched bit.
The "life keeps getting stranger line" has special emphasis.
BS: "Quiet please, can't hear meself think up here." (not preserved on the soundboard version but is on the audience tape)
The intro for this version sounds more like Video 586 than the PC&L release, However, the lyrics are the same as the release. The break survives in the untitled portion of PC&L between "The Village" and "586".
This segues right into _Temptation_, and from there into _Everythings___Gone___Green_.
There's a dropout for a few seconds in all copies of EGG I've heard (at about 2:20) so that's likely a problem with the master. The sound effects rock, lots of reverb on Barney's vocals...this is about the time New Order really start coming into their own.
It sounds like the fans are yelling "Barney"...but it could be Italian for "more".
PH: "If you liked the last three, you'll like this one." (only on audience version, soundbard has it cut)
This is the Sparks cover. It's extraordinary that New Order also had one other cover (Turn The Heater On) and an original (Too Late) that were debuted in the same month, but were never heard from again, at least in their original form.
At about 3:35, Barney states, "This is why we don't do encores..." and at 3:54, "This is a bad idea." There's a brief dropout at the 4:44 count that's present on the Sol version but not on the TS version. At almost the 11:00 Hooky starts playing the bass riff for Ceremony.
My original copy was supposedly a 3rd gen soundboard tape (most likely really an audience tape), 'davemings' on STG seeded a 2nd gen copy that sounds very pleasing to these ears.
There has been some confusion over how many sets were played. The consensus is that there was only one, with the "first" set listed matching the one listed for Tenax - Florence, Italy, with IALP tacked on. I may have done my part in perpetuating this error, since the original Waterrat listing did *not* list two sets (though it seems to now!)
I'll keep the following from 'twist' for now, as it documents the ficticious set:
"I think this was for the opening of the hacienda. Anywho, two sets played. Power cut during the second set. From NOOL "There were two sets for those lucky few who had managed to get into the opening of the Hacienda, in what would be a momentous night. Overcoming the sound problems was the first problem faced by the band, as the power blew during Ultraviolence at the start of the second [sic] set, and the sound system was generally churning out a muddy and uneven sound.
The first set (Dreams Never End, 586, Procession, Chosen Time, Truth, Senses, Ultraviolence, Everything's Gone Green, Temptation, In A Lonely Place) contained no surprises, and it was left to the headline set to get everyone on their feet (20 minute delay not withstanding). Re-opening with In A Lonely Place and Ultraviolence before the powercut, the band came back to pummel us with Denial, spark curiosity with The Village, chill us out with We All Stand, speed things up again with a rejuvenated Senses and Chosen Time, finishing with the new electronic way forward in the face of the triumvirate that was 586, Temptation and EGG."
CW recalls that there was a soundcheck tape with We All Stand, The Village, 586, Temptation, EGG, which he never had a copy of.
I've been able to trace down three versions:
(1) Bootleg version, the one with the '82 Italian dates
(2) 'davemings' STG version.
(3) Since then, another version has surfaced, which is more complete in that it has a compere introducing the venue.
I figure (2) was recorded closer to the PA, and is loud, with somewhat better sound than (3). (1) sounds the murkiest of the lot.
From (3), announcer (unidentified, not Tony Wilson):
"Hacienda. That's really for members. Next Tuesday, for the 29th of June, we have 52nd Street and Swamp Children. The Saturday after that, the 3rd of July, the rearranged Funkapolitan. And the Wednesday, 7th of July, a concert you shouldn't miss, Liaisons Dangereuse, and on Friday, the 9th of July, A Certain Ratio. [punter: "that's quite good, innit"] What about that? The next newsletter will be out pretty soon, as will the membership cards, still problems getting the embossing done at a very secret printers. Admission very soon will be even lower, that means even though you'll pay nothing tonight, we'll pay you to come. Okay, this is not just another venue, but a club, and it's based not on mere consumption but on contribution. So what are you going to give? (punter: money). So the Hacienda gives you, tonight, New Order!"
Josef K says that Barney may have played keyboards for 52nd Street for that gig, but hasn't been able to confirm it.
Then a 52nd Street ("Cool As Ice", I think) song comes over the PA.
_In___A___Lonely___Place_ starts out things.
BS: "One two." And then a couple of notes on the melodica, which bear a striking resemblence to the opening synth line of Sooner Than You Think, two years early. Synth here sounds very untuned. (3) is the most complete, (1) only has the trailing bit of the melodica blast, a clink of glasses, and somebody a few seconds into the drum intro saying something like "what a lousy place" (2) has the melodica and then punters yelling out "Oh!" and "Bernard."
Then _Ultraviolence_, with the bass levels being a bit too high and causing a bit of distortion...in line with the comments made above about the problems with the Hacienda's PA. Barney's vocals are full of reverb as usual on '82 recordings.
At shortly before 3:30 the power cuts out, leaving the audience shouting in confusion.
Alan Erasmus (thanks to Dave Mings for the ID) and Wilson talk next.
RG: "...a little problem. It's gonna get ugly(?) eh? Just stick around please."
[only heard on (2), (3) has an edit point starting here]
TW: "It's either a fuse or a bad wire, if it's only a bad wire, it should be traceable, it'll be about ten minutes. Sorry about this solution."
Another edit and a bit more crowd before the power is restored and New Order start over playing _Ultraviolence_ again.
_The___Village_ has an interesting bass synth riff not otherwise present on the release.
About 30 seconds gap between this one and the next song, which is _We___All___Stand_. On (3), a punter identifies the track.
Drop-out in right channel at 4:14, lasts about 10 seconds. (2)
A/B split between We All Stand and _Senses_, fadeout captures the first couple seconds of boinging synths, which is cold-start replayed. Another small break before the next one, _Chosen___Time_.
(3) has an edit point after Chosen Time.
Then follows _586_, with the Touch records sequencer sound rather than the later PCL sound. Bass sound is distorted here. Bit of a drop in levels at about 15:10, coming back at about 15:25. (2)
(3) sounds complete to these ears.
Folks deem this performance to be a bit lackluster, since it was a bit of a one-off, maybe New Order was underrehearsed. Also could be that the crowd wasn't getting into it, so the band wasn't, and vice versa.
Tape I have is the one davemings seeded to EZT, which he lists as possibly being second generation. And, wonder of wonders, a *soundboard* recording of this gig has surfaced!
To quote Mark Johnson:
"Held on a windy, rain-swept evening near Blackpool's North Pier, this concert was promoted and supported by Section 25, with an appearance by Kevin Hewick. It was one of the group's rare nationally-advertised concerts and one Portuguese fan travelled all the way from Lisbon to see them. Though New Order's digital sequencer had failed the week before and could not be repaired in time for the concert, the band rented equipment for the event. "Age Of Consent", written that month, was debuted and the sell-out crowd of 1,000 gave New Order a tumultuous reception."
And indeed, this explains why the sequenced tracks sound so different, with "586" being especially amazing. *This* is simply the best version of that track ever, which shames all later versions, with the opening guitar and ending synth and bass work being stunning. And a version of "We All Stand" that's a keeper, though Hurt for some reason is a shambles, as the sequencer mysteriously speeds up a bit after 3:00 in.
Notes pertain to audience tape, unless where otherwise indicated.
JC on EZT writes:
"_Procession_ starts a bit muffled presumably just as the keyboards start up, and there's a pronounced shuffling of the microphone between 4 to 8 seconds into this first track, and it sounds as though the microphone carrier was clapping at the end of 'Procession' just as the keyboards wind-down."
At the end there's a feedback squall, plus Hooky off-mic shouting out "Wanker! You musty(?) twat...".
More shouting from the same bloke as before after the applause, which dies out to near-silence, almost unheard of for an Order gig.
Mic scuffle at 0:12-0:13. Old style intro, actually a bit different than other versions either before or after, which might be because the sequencer is playing the song in a different key than PH or BS are. Thanks to indiearchivist for that observation.
_Truth_ follows to polite applause.
The intro to _We___All____Stand_ is much unlike anything I've heard from this song...it's starts out much too fast a tempo, which is slowed down right before Bernard plays. A pity, because it's a really cool effect.
Hooky tunes his bass at the end. Somebody says "Does [something] like that?
There's a brief tape edit on the audience tape here.
PH: "Don't give a fuck."
The soundboard tape has an edit after this.
The sequencers mysteriously speed up at about 3:24, probably throwing off Hooky's bass riff. A shambolic performance.
(one of the audience versions)
Somebody says "one more", someone else says "ten minutes, ten minutes", and then the same person, closer to the mic, says "fourteen minutes". Wonder if this refers to how much tape is left.
PH: "Got one of those rigs, Steve?"
A long pause then a couple of guitar noises.
More conversation about how much time is left, the reply this time is "ten minutes".
The debut performance!
The lyrics strike me as being looser than other early performances, with Barney singing in a falsetto at one point.
Song strips down before ending. Sounds like tape is slowed down and then stopped rather than the normal cut.
Sound quality gets noticeably worse, a lot more hissy. There's some talking at the beginning of this which may correspond with JC getting up and leaving, assuming JC was near the taper as he seems to suggest.
Gap at 0:50 (tape flip?) and a left channel drop at 1:02.
Quite a few improvisional lyrics, the best bit being, "This is the end...I like the end, and some very nice cooing.".
The song ends in some synth effects.
JC's account of the gig, from EZT:
"Did a quick download and listening now. First thing that strikes me is that the recorder was nowhere near the PA, probably taking a central position. I guess it was a good way back too, as I have memories of a decent crowd near the band at the front. If you compare with the Blackpool Scamps recording in 1980, you can tell that Scamps was a small, low-roofed club.
I too was towards the back of the concert hall, which may go some way to explain why I didn't enjoy the sound either. I arrived just in time for New Order after a few strong lemonades in the Metropole Hotel across the road.
The performance is not as bad as I remember, but it's a lacklustre effort at times. Looking at the dates on the website Live Browser, this one is a bit of a one-off, so they may only have practiced at the soundcheck? The crowd are not offering too much assistance either. It takes two to tango, and neither band or crowd are giving much.
I didn't miss as much as I thought, as I'm sure I heard 'Age Of Consent', and left presumably during 'Ultraviolence'. Now that was lacklustre. I was with my friend Martin, who also liked New Order a lot and played in one of the support bands when Joy Division played Blackpool in 1979, and we both were underwhelmed by the event.
If memory further serves me correctly, this event was an attempt at something Factory were trying to do, which was to provide DJ's and dance music, and have short sets from bands too. That date would have been the Monday of the late August Holiday weekend, so maybe a few worn-out souls had spent all their energy by that Monday night?
Having to go back to work after the Monday holiday dampened our spirits, those that had work in 1982!!!!
Description from http://slashmc.rice.edu/ceremony/neworder/no_disc/notapes.html
Tape bootleg lists:
ultraviolence, dreams never end, denial, unknown pleasures (interesting title for 'leave me alone' ed.), procession, chosen time, in a lonely place, everything's gone green, temptation, probable result ("I'm not the kind...") 586 (encore) [all sic] Incl. new song "Age of Consent"
Tape I have is of indeterminate quality, second or third generation. I also have an MP3, which uses a different source (need to verify this). Don't know which sounds better. Both snotters and waterisnat from STG seeded copies of this gig, but mine may be superior, although not really enough to warrant a re-reseed.
In 2006, a new version taped by v1 surfaced, better than any prior version.
Some good Bernie whoops and screams during _Ultraviolence_. Waterisnat's version has a dropout at 2:32.
Snotters' version has a brief dropout at 0:50. Mix has Hooky's vocals very low.
Punter on Snotters version comments that this is an old song.
Volume drop on Snotters' tape between 0:20-0:35, not present on other tapes, as well as at the 3:50 point.
_Leave___Me___Alone_ has different lyrics, kinda hard to make out, but Bernard repeats "It's the last time" a few times.
On the v1 version, the taper comments that he'd rather sit down for a bit, with his female companion assenting.
_Procession_ has a bit of "one two" soundchecking during the intro.
A remarkable occurance:
_Chosen___Time_ segues into _In___A___Lonely___Place_ (with a detour into Hooky playing a bit of the bassline for _Decades_), which segues into _Everythings___Gone___Green_, which has a Hooky count-in and innovative dub effects, which segues into _Temptation_.
A/B split on v1 tape at this point.
Hooky has a false start with bass intro to _Age___Of___Consent_. Bernard sings "I wish I was black and had a six foot long dick." Don't we all?
The Snotters audience tape has somebody commenting on Bernard's change of lyrics. "He changed the words?"
Edit on v1 version.
Meanwhile people are cheering for an encore, which NO give, in the form of _586_, sounding like Prime 5-8-6 but with vocals.
PH: "This is only because you've been here long as we have."
Sound is nothing to write home about.
Hooky checking the mics and other miscellany
_Temptation_ starts things off, and sounds fairly bouncy.
A break between _Procession_ and _Ultraviolence_ and some audience chatter. At the start of of UV Bernard says a word or two that's impossible to make out. There's a tape cut about 2:30 in. Very interesting 'stutter' ending.
The intro to Ultraviolence gets fired off by mistake.
More audience chatter (in Greek) as New Order prep for the next song.
BS: "Shut up, you stupid p...sters!"
A loud reverb/echoed scream after the "end of the road" bit. Barney sings "to the end of the road" near the end. Song ends abruptly with the keyboard motif played really badly.
Bernard says something that starts of with, "If you got..." but I can'tmake out the rest.
Features following stanza after the bridge:
"Too hard to rumble/Too hard to humble/Too hard to mumble."
Edit in tape, so the first bit is cut.
This one also has different lyrics, with Bernard announcing "I hate you...I don't know you, and I don't want to." and a lot of other bits that will be fun to pick out.
_Dreams___Never___End_ is its usual rousing self.
New Order tune and Bernard mumbles out something to introduce. They try to play the Village, but fail, and the crowd boos in derision.
Features the homage to Lou Reed involving skin color and hugely-sized genitalia.
As well as, "I have a boy that needs to tell you..." and "Well, the past is the past and the present is never..." and other improvisations I need to pick out.
The A and B sides to FAC33, _Ceremony_ and _In___A___Lonely___Place_, close out the set.
The following was the original entry, which I believe is not true:
"Tracks 9-11 of the second 'Dreams Never End' boot are taken from this performance. There's no audience banter to speak of, but sound quality is very good, having originated as a soundboard recording."
Master clone kindly supplied from GaoBest and TMK.
Huge glitch (like the tape was chewed up) from about 2:30 - 3:00.
Interesting announcer-type male voice from 3:25 - 3:50.
Dunno if this is tape bleed, a sample used by the group, or some other form of interference. I'm betting the latter. Another similar glitch between 5:10 - 5:20...definitely seems to be damage on the master tape.
This interference runs throughout, and is really strange, as it's not backwards (indicative of bleed-through).
_Dreams___Never___End_ and _Ceremony_ follow.
Tuning between _Procession_ and _Temptation_.
Break in tape between _In___A___Lonely___Place_ and _Senses_. The beginning of Senses has a pretty clear sample of what runs in parallel.
A bit of tuning before _Denial_.
lyric: "I wish I was black and I had a six foot dick/ I'd shove it down your throat and make you sick."
There's an internal cut after about 5:15, this must have been where the original A/B flip point was.
A classic version!
We only have the last 1:10 from this, and it sounds like it originates from a different (higher-gen) source, but is in stereo and is quite a bit hissier than the rest of these tracks, as well as possibly being pitched too fast. Of course, the importance of this can't be overstated, as this is the debut live performace of this seminal track.
I have a video of this, while my version appears to have been an optical transfer, and therefore nearly unwatchable, through the magic of the Internet, we now have a much better copy.
Here's what GaoBest has to say about this one:
"I think 11-27-82 is from a close-circuit recording; the venue consisted of a bar room and a performance room, and used tripod cameras for a close-circuit feed into tv sets in the bar room. Excellent quality photography, but of course generation loss... but if you've been to the Shoreline, I'm sure you've been to the bar during music performance, or seen the "overscreen" TV screens, which show band footage scenes... just like that!"
His version is better, not being an optical transfer, though the color cuts in and out...it's seen one too many generations of copies. Writeup is based on his copy.
There are probably brief edits between all of the tracks.
Apparently this *wasn't* from closed-circuit TV but was filmed in the balcony. Reports are that an instrumental version of 'New Dawn Fades' was played at soundcheck.
There's an individual wearing a blue Duke t-shirt (Terry Mason) that is leaning back in a Christ-like post for much of the performance of this song.
All the band are facing in different directions. Bernard is wearing a sleeveless white shirt with a badge of an eagle on a shield, Gillian a knee-high print dress, Hooky in stark contrast to the singer/guitarist wearing a sleeveless black shirt, and Stephen a long-sleeved white collared shirt.
The intro to _Ultraviolence_ gurgles until Gillian presses something. Intense, amazing.
lyric: "Down to the ground / In your shit-hole!"
Bernard switches his guitar before the start of this track. At the end, he goes over to the banks of keyboards and starts fiddling.
Starts with an off-focus closeup on Hooky.
Duke of Christ-pose is back.
New Order lose the plot somewhat near the end of this song. Apparently Barney has problems with his guitar, eyeing the bridge, which may have been the source of the problems.
Newly-discovered footage has surfaced of this song, but with a worse-quality soundtrack.
Vocoder makes its appearance. Bernard sings the first line in a near-croon, but shifts to a more restrained vocal. Stephen steps away from the drumkit and goes behind the keyboard. Sound starts to cut out between first and second verses.
Second time this song is ever played live, the first being two nights before. Remarkably well-formed for such a virgin rendering, lyrics are complete including the classic 'why don't you piss off' bit. About the only thing different is the sound of the syndrum.
_Temptation_ is cut from this recording, only the first couple of seconds survive on most copies. However, it was recorded, albeit with loads of distortion.
The sound of _Denial_ cuts out a couple of times.
The second-ever performance, the first having been two nights before. This is the first performance with vocals, the previous one having been instrumental.
Bernard sits down and sips at his beverage through the intro. Hooky is playing drums throughout. Not otherwise much different than the version we all know and love.
One minor difference is Bernard sings "How should I feel" instead of "How do I feel". And Gillian's keyboard playing is lovingly shaky here. At one point, Barney and Stephen start talking, in and of itself a fairly unusual occurence.
No setlist for this performance has surfaced...
This was just posted by one "Brubut" on DIME, in a thread about Irvine:
"Thanks for posting this. It reminds me of the first NO gig I saw at The Capitol Theatre Sydney in 1982. I was the record company person looking after support John Cooper Clarke and he and NO decided to do a surprise encore of Lady Godiva's Operation. JCC spent the day at my place learning the lyrics. On the night most people had started leaving the show due to the New Order Don't do Encores signes everywhere when they came back on for a stunning and unique version of the VU track. The sad news is back at the hotel later that night drinking with NO and JCC I was briefly (legally) in posession of the desk tape but someone from NO's crew asked for it back. Question is, has anyone got a recording of this show in particular the encore?"
Now that would be something worth hearing, wouldn't it? Perhaps the tape still exists in the Gretton box, but who knows if it's got the encore track on it."
When asked about the setlist, he replied:
"Unfortunately I couldn't possibly remember the set list. I should have grabbed one when I was back stage. Hinsight is such a great thing. I might see if I can chase up a copy through JCC. See if he ever got a copy of the tape. I was originally given the desk tape to make him a copy but it was taken away by someone (tour manager) who said they'd do it. If I ever get it I'll certainly share it on DIME."
_Age___Of___Consent_, _Chosen___Time_, and _Ultraviolence_ are played without any comment.
A bit of a pause between this number and _We___All___Stand_.
Brief cut at 2:03.
Song has strange tempo changes during the middle part.
_Your___Silent___Face_ is up next.
Brief cut at the start of Procession.
_586_ and _Temptation_ follow.
From AR master recording, not especially clear but plenty good enough for the purpose.
This date was originally given for Christchurch, but it turns out that both 06 DEC and 08 DEC were in Wellington.
A bit of bass soundchecking before the song starts.
(Between 'line of force from heaven' and 'a tear in a strangers eye')
BS: "Turn the foldback on please."
punter: "Still can't see a bloody thing..."
Other assorted comments before the band start in on _Everythings___Gone___Green_.
Lots of audience chatter at the two minute mark.
Taper or someone close to him says 'In A Lonely Place'. The group play _Chosen___Time_ instead.
_We___All___Stand_ features quite a distinctive bass synth sound here.
BS: "Drum machine through the foldback please."
At the end, somebody says, "Gillian, give me a smile..."
"who saw those dark eyes?
who saw those dark eyes?
touch my skin
burn like coal
in this shithole
shut your mouth
A fucking bore(?)..."
Punter cries out for 'Mesh', which they stopped playing in early 1981.
False start for _Ceremony_.
Another cry for 'Mesh'.
Call for 'Dreams Never End'...but the last song turns out to be _586.
The original Gigography listing for both this and the 06 DEC 82 gigs are believed to be swapped, with this having been listed as the Christchurch date. This has been fixed.
Details regarding this gig from GaoBest
note: this is the mixing desk recording; originally recorded on reel-to-reel tape, in incorrect phasing; phasing corrected in 1983 or 1984 or so; later archived to DAT in LP (32khz) speed. note: there is also an audience recording, of which I've not yet heard to determine if the 5-8-6 track is longer.
Fans say stuff like "fuck this" during the silence after the false start.
Somebody burps before the start of _Temptation_.
_Dreams___Never___End_ and _The___Him_ follow.
Then a halting start to _Leave___Me___Alone_.
The last lines of the first stanza are "And all days end just the same."
End bass notes back into _Hurt_.
This version has different lyrics at the end. The reverb makes it difficult to make these out.
_Denial_ is next, followed by _Age___Of___Consent_.
Hooky calls out "1-2-3-4", which can barely be heard, out of the break.
Some drum sequences.
(the following is in response to a heckler, but I can't entirely make it out)
BS: "I can't fucking hear a word you're saying so if you don't like it, you can fuck off. She said...making fun of us...in fact, I could be in bed at this very moment. You like drums? I hope you like drums because it goes on like this for another half an hour, and there's another one just the same after it." (thanks to tribeca737 for the corections)
"Those who came before you/
Made a real mess/
From the murder to confusion/
We'll turn away no more."
There's also other twists...as this is a very early version, only the third time that this is played. Love the ending, pitch-shifted synth wash.
The taper inadvertantly hits pause about about 6:47 or so. (this might refer to the beginning part of 586, which on the soundboard version is 16:20 long)
After about 14:00, the tempo speeds up.
GaoBest reports the setlist as the following.
> 12-14-82 Old Melbourne Hotel, Perth
> 1. Temptation (cut in middle)
> 2. Dreams Never End
> 3. Chosen Time
> 4. We All Stand
> 5. Leave Me Alone
> 6. 586
> 7. Senses (cut off at end)
> 8. Everything's Gone Green
> 9. Denial
> 10. Your Silent Face
> 11. Blue Monday
> 12. Age of Consent
> 13. Ceremony
> notes: taped by Petra Kaiser (university student?)
This means that tracks 7-9 are missing from the Gigography listing.
Norman Peters writes in:
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 2000 17:20:12 +1100
From: "Peters, Norman (JHD)"
Subject: New Order gig guide.
Re: New Order gig guide.
I was at the one on 14 December 1982 at the Old Melbourne Hotel, Perth. The support act was a local band called "House Above the World", led by Chris Savage.
New Order came on late, and they were plainly tired - someone - Sumner? - announced that as it was the end of the World Tour they had a right to be tired. The Emulator keyboard played by Gilbert went badly out of tune and caused the heckling referred to. It was generally a lousy gig, and they couldn't wait to finish it.
Jan Bollansee has kindly transcribed the bootleg liner notes:
Reports from the homeland inform us that we could expect something special. Originally members of 'Joy Division' until the untimely death of Ian Curtis, they made the brave (and wise) decision to change the name to 'New Order'. Initially they were 3, later to be joined by Gillian Gilbert.
Now at last we have had the opportunity to see and hear the band ourselves.
Speaking personally, I am now thinking of moving to Manchester, England, this band has changed my way of life. To watch them live on stage is an experience, truly amazing. The sheer beauty of their music shines out.
Now, Conco Records give 'YOU' the chance to share the magic of a 'New Order' concert on this record.
Look out Manchester, I think you're about to receive a large number of immigrants.
President. Perth raincoat brigade. 1983."
His comments regarding the recording:
"This is a pretty good, though by no means perfect audience recording. There is, in fact, quite a bit of chatter from people in the vicinity of the taper, but it's never distracting as no-one starts to sing along (which is hardly unexpected seeing that the majority of the tracks hadn't been released so far). Some of the exchanges are, in fact, kind of funny and certainly add to the atmosphere of the recording (look out for the comments about ear plugs and the bass playing). Enjoy!"
Sound quality ok, hissy. Not very good stereo seperation. This is taken from the 'They Came... We Saw... Their Music Conquered." bootleg.
My copy has sides A and B transposed, so A has _Leave___Me___Alone_, _586_, _Ceremony_ , and B has Temptation through _We___All___Stand_.
Brief dropout after the "green eyes, blue eyes, grey eyes" line.
_Dreams___Never___End_ is then played.
Male voice: "Should have brought yer earplugs." Female voice: "I got them..."
Wonder if the female in question is Petra Kaiser...
Heckler yells out something profane, which the guy standing next to the taper repeats.
BS: "Can I have a moment of silence, please?"
Make voice: "Pretty intense?"
Real drawn-out "At the end of the roo..oad".
Some improvisation about BS seeing his son (his son may have been born around this time, who knows)
taper: "He knows it's there, he knows it, a special quality."
A guy in the audience close to the recorder can be heard repeating "All the bass is taped", which he repeats thrice...saying Hooky plays only melodies. Poppycock, of course, New Order had long ago stopped using backing tapes.
Heckler can be heard mouthing off crap.
BS then says: "Shut up, shitface!"
Somebody else says "Take a load of this", sounding amused at Barney's crack.
This song mysteriously fades out halfway through.
Next songs on this tape are from "The Dream" bootleg (without the Peel Session tunes)
Dreams Never End
In A Lonely Place
Then there's some weird early 80's synth song with female vocals, don't recognize the artist (end-of-side filler)
Back to the Melbourne gig:
_Your___Silent___Face_ breaks down about 15 seconds in.
Hooky says something unintelligable. Somebody comments they haven't heard this one before, as there appear to have been no less than six songs that hadn't been released.
YSF starts up again. Ending is somewhat abrupt.
There about 20 seconds of audience background, then Blue Monday kicks in. Hooky says something about "a bit more of the high [?] in the foldback", can't quite make it out.
This is only the fourth time BM had been played live. Aside from the primitive sound of the drums, this version is surprisingly mature. There's a big dropout in the middle of the song, probably there in the source. Blue Monday ends with the mellotronish "aah" sounds.
Straightforward versions of _Age___Of___Consent_ and _Ceremony_, played a bit faster than normal.
Sound becomes a bit better.