Picture of Bernie New

Face Up - 19 Mar 84 - Caesar's Palace - Bradford England

There's been a few (?) between two
Just the two of us
You know I hope, I hope it's always been the same I've known you since you were sixteen
Between your legs I've always been

A perfect fit, that, your hairy twat
But your hairy twat is like a fur trap

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you

Being like we used to be
Alone on our own just the two us
Now you left me all alone
To serve my pride(?), my very own

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you Living on my own
Just the one I need
Just make me fall for the rest of your life

We've all done this a few times now
I like shagging you but I also think
You are a fucking fat cow
You've got spots

I go to someone else I know
Even though I love you
I can't leave you alone like I know I should You've got a brain like a piece of wood

And oh how I cannot bear the thought of you Loving you like I used to do
We're always meant for each other
Brother, someone so like my brother

Oh you're gone such a long time now

It's been such a long time, now
It's been such a long time, now

Between your ears I've seen your face
It's caused me very much disgrace
You look like the Elephant Man
That's just talking so I can

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you Seeing you like I used to do
I never knew it would come to this
It all started from the perfect kiss!
The perfect kiss!
The perfect kiss!

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you, ooh

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you Seeing you...

NO: 30 MAR 84 Uni-Mensa - Dusseldorf

Likely two audience recordings, the one used for the gigography listing, and the one from TJ

The incomplete version misses KW1 and Temptation and has is missing half of the last song. The more complete version apparently includes the soundcheck of 'Confusion'.


Bernard starts out the second verse singing in a falsetto!

BS: "Thank you very much. Sorry about that. We had a slight technical problems."

A couple of bass notes.


One of the versions that mentions 'afterbirth'.


BS: "Take you down a little now, this one's about war."

_586_ follows.

The usual soundchecking before _Confusion_.

Brief cut at 2:25 during that song (On the TJ-source version).

BS: "That was Confusion. Buy it, bastards."

_Denial_ follows.

Very interesting drum sounds right before _Blue___Monday_.

lyric: "If it wasn't for your misfortune, I'd be a stupid cunt today."

Bernard throws in 'Love Reaction/Gives me satisfaction' as well.

Brief cut on TJ version.


BS: "The first time we ever played before...just [something] up and down." (hard to make out)

Features 'scratch' lyrics used during 1984 performances of this song.

Some comments in German as people shout for an encore.

Another cut (TJ-sourced version)


BS: "This is a very slow song...[can't make out]...punters, oh dear. It's called 'Are you Lonesome Tonight?"

NO: 31 MAR 84 Haus Nied - Frankfurt, Germany

3-4th generation audience tape, your typical bootleg quality bootleg. But better than some!

According to Al Jarvis, a coachload of Brits, among them including Jon Marsh (The Beloved) and 'that bloke from EMF...older than the rest of them' were among the luminaries along for the ride, so that is why the crowd sounds like the typical Brit gig...

They open with _Skullcrusher_, which has vocals. The is the first time this one is ever played live. It has different lyrics than the Paradiso version commonly available on MP3.


BS: "Thanks very much...You tell us what you want us to play and we'll play it."

NO don't do much talking until the break after _Your___Silent___Face_.

BS: "We won't play Temptation tonight because we played it last night. We are playing _Thieves___Like___Us_ now because we didn't play it last night."

The intro to _Hurt_ gets flubbed a bit.

Intro to _Age___of___Consent_ has Bernard mouthing out the following, in broken English.

BS: "We play special long set for you Germans tonight."

After the Order finish, Barney makes the following comment.

BS: "Who said punk was dead?"

Bernard introduces _In___A___Lonely___Place_ with a remarkable statement.

BS: "This is the most evil song I have ever heard in my life."

NO: 02 APR 84 Volkshaus - Zurich, Switzerland

Source is a tape from my archives. I had assumed this was taken from an FM broadcast, but I suspect that at least my version is a very good audience tape.

Sound (except for the first track) is excellent. Hooky's bass has a similar strange sound that it would during the '85 Australasian tour. My tape also has an interview with the band (probably in either France or Switzerland) done in '84 at the end of side A.

Stephen Smith adds:

"I've been cleaning up my own cassette of this one and it seems to have a couple of differences to your own. My cassette is from the late 80's and was copied from a friend (who picked up a lot of New Order/Joy Division live stuff as well, sadly, he disposed of them a while back, I kept all of mine). So, there is a little bit more hiss than would have been on his original cassette. I have cleaned the tracks a little but only slightly as I didn't want to start impinging on the music itself. My cassette doesn.t have any interview on it."


This version is cut at the beginning and has a right-channel dropout until nearly the end of the song (4:13). Some editions of this gig don't even include this track. Stephen's does include all of it, but there's a cut at about 0:41 in, where it continues is where most of the other versions start.

Weird scream at 2:20, audible in the right channel.

Stephen Smith:

"Track starts with radio announcers voice, for about 6 seconds or so, tinkering strains of the 586 piano part can be heard in the background. Recording volume is quieter at the beginning until around the 40 second mark, then it kicks in fully. No right channel drop out on my cassette except for a tiny glitch at the 3.30 mark. I transferred the undamaged channel here but changed it back, it didn.t really improve it to any great degree and I prefer not to go overboard on these tapes."


A bit of amp buzz right at the start.

Fans call out for Warsaw and say stuff in their native tongue.


BS: "It's just called Ultraviolence."

Additional lyrics appear in this version;

"Who saw the darkness? I felt the devil. He was so close by...I ran for the sky
His eyes were dark and brown.
He looked at me like a torn (?)"

[Thanks to the aforementioned Stephen Smith for the correction to the above. He couldn't make out the last part either.]

A very loud voice yells out:

"Thank you, thank you, thank you! Blue Monday."

BS: "Thanks very much everybody, it's really nice of you to come and see us."

More calls for BM.

Same voice calls, "C'mon lads, give us Blue Monday!". Somebody replies to him, "Shut yer mouth."

BS: "Slight technical problem there."

Barney plays some notes on his guitar and such.

PH: "It's the adverts from the radio."


Is titled 'Meaning Of Life' on my tape.

This is the live debut of this track. Sequencer patterns are different for this one, obviously. Lyrics mention the "thousand lines away" bit, and the chorus is "You know we love you" repeated a few times.

He also sings:

"Switzerland is a wonderful country, it's full of mountain and leaves and flowers. We...someone...(summer?), like it does in England, the girls in...so much prettier. But unfortunately, everyone in Basel are cunts."

[Thanks to Stephen for filling in some of the blanks]


Also has buzzing in the right channel. Other copies don't have this defect.

The group then shoot right into _Denial_.


BS: "We know what we'll do, don't worry. (in a high-pitched voice) Procession".

Another additional lyric.

lyric: "Your life is your own, my life doesn't involve you, boy."


BS: "Right, sort the fucking triggers out, somebody."

There's a bit of noise at about 3:05.

BS: "Oh great, fucking back to you..."

Somebody yells out "just play more guitar", and you can hear Bernard drop the mic.

(edit in tape)


BS: "This next song's called Temptation. It's a story about, eh... a long lost love."


This is the last song in the set. Performance is somewhat a shambles.

NO: 06 APR 84 Wiener Arena - Vienna

Source is a second-gen, but fairly hissy and azimuth-challenged recording.

_586_ opens the set, which they dispatch with quickly.

BS: "This song's called _Everythings___Gone___Green_."

BS: "Thanks a lot for [it?]."

_Your___Silent___Face_ follows.

During the bridge, you can hear the singer mutter something that unfortunately on this recording is unintelligible.

Bernard sings "why don't you fuck off" for this one.

BS: "Thank you...proof that we have, eh... 'Your Silent Face'" (not completely understandable here)

_Senses_ follows. Has the improvised extra verse often seen with this song in post-'82 performances.

BS: "Thank you very much. That's our most, er, macho record for today."


(at the end)

BS: "Thank you very much. Don't say perfect(?)"

_Chosen___Time_ is next.


Hooky strums the bass

BS: "A few technical problems on this next song."

PH: "Ah, he's going for a piss. When a man's gotta go, he's gotta go. Unfortunately, we won't be able to jam, won't we Steve?"

The song starts in, pauses, and then restarts.


On the tape, the intro is cut.


Someone mumbles something at the start that sounds like "he'll knock you over" and then I think later on Bernard tells Steve to hurry up a little bit.

New Order break between the main set and encore.


BS: "Only happen in the work.[?]...Cuz we're all cute, and we're all crude for...to take the stage for this version of Blue Monday. This song is for all the...ladies in ze audience, they are quite welcome to come backstage for a drink..." (Hooky's bass obscures the final word)

PH: "This is [if he?] will heed our advice...we were telling him...Blue Monday." [very unsure of the wording here]

BS: "Just waiting for the sequencer to load."


PH: "This is, erm, Black Heart."

Set the controls for the heart of the black hole.

Lyrics are completely improvised, much in the same way New Order would do for Do The Ostrich or Sister Ray.

NO: 08 APR 84 Metropol - Berlin Germany

Source: download from http://neworder.simplenet.com/newdawnfades

(notes from the above website...at least when it existed, stuff seems to be at http://www.geocities.com/~newdawnfades now)

This looks like it's taken from an LP bootleg. Sound is fairly boomy, and alas, there seem to be some skips. I've subsequently got a complete, lossless copy.

At the beginning of Track 6 on the bootleg is improvisation but it sounds like Sister Ray which leads into Confusion. Also, listen to Bernard's disgust with the Berlin audience at the beginning of Track 6.

This concert also features an early version of Face Up. The lyrics sound like they are being made up on the spot.

(my own notes follow)


An illustration on why fans of the Order's live efforts think that the '84 versions of this song are best.


Bernard's opening solo is a bit off.


Profanity alert: "my eyes are made of stone...just like your fucking home"

_Your___Silent___Face_ is played next. Virtually nothing audible from the crowd.

Hooky tunes up between this and _Dreams___Never___End, which passes through in a blur. After which you can hear a solitary punter call out for Everything's Gone Green.


BS: "Why you horrible bastards."

Third time this song is ever performed. Great sounds in this one, especially if you like bass. I would actually differ with George's opinion that the lyrics are being "made up on the spot", though obviously the arrangement is far from the final version. The chorus can be heard a couple of times through it, for instance.

Tape edit at this point on the lossless version.


BS: "...grateful."
[tape is missing first part of this utterance]

BS: "This is a laid-back set tonight."

You can hear stuff getting plugged out and back in again, which should tell you what kind of audience this was.

_Sister___Ray_ (improv)

BS: "Right, you're the most miserable fucking audience we've ever played to in our fucking lives. *Never* *ever* want to come back to Berlin again, ever, you MISERABLE FUCKING BASTARDS. (spit)"

They did come back in 2001, all was forgiven.

All of this has to be heard to be appreciated.

Some strange sampling along with tuneless chords at this point.

BS: "I didn't mean that, actually" "It was just...the season was wrong..." (both sentences are lost in a wash of reverb)

The improv version of Sister Ray segues into _Confusion_,

BS: "How about Confusion, you..."
(all of this is buried in reverb, very hard to make out)


Ends with motorcycle samples, which also appear on the final track of this set, _Temptation_.

Face Up 08 Apr 84 Metropol - Berlin

I met you three years ago
Your...was trapped in a drunken(?)...
Your eyes was green, your nose was big
My heart felt low, many lives(?) were hot(?)...

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you Knowing you like I used to do
[can't make out a couple of lines]
Knowing you like I used to do

You said three years ago thought our lives... You went down the longest [can't make out](?) Lives will be torn about yours too...
Yours and me, we'll look at you.

I love you like I knew I should.
I love you like a piece of wood.

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you

Knowing you like I used to do
Our lives rebel from...you're good.
From the bedroom to the bathroom floor
Oh, you don't need me anymore

Oh it's so good, oh it's so right
That belongs to my wife.

I hurt you like I knew I would.
That's why I treat you like a piece of wood.

I have all this sound I want
Oh, the devil will believe you
I have all of your time, a long time ago I never will believe, I never will believe I never will believe you
(last two lines repeated three times or so)

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you

I never will believe, never will believe you You won't...believe it too.

We have ...in there...
Our life was...

[Bernard falsettos a few words]

You have all those years in our lives to go We were just like children that play,
I knew you would...
Moving apart, moving apart
Moving apart, moving apart
Moving...ing..ing..ing apart

(in falsetto)
Moving apart, moving apart
Moving apart, moving...ing...ing apart
Moving apart
You want me so, and that was that

(falsetto again)
Moving apart, moving apart
Moving apart, moving apart

I loved you like I knew I should
Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you Knowing you like I used to do
In your heart, this stays new


I guess you know the day
I guess you know the day
I guess you know...

NO: 10 APR 84 Saga Cinema - Copenhagen

_Ceremony_ opens the set.

BS: "Thanks very much, everybody."

_Dreams___Never___End_ follows.

Hooky screams the word "scream" at the end. Awesome.

_The___Village_ follows.

Synths go seriously out of tune for _Sooner___Than___You___Think_, which features the developmental version of the lyrics, with "You know that I love you" being the chorus.

_Leave___Me___Alone_ is next.


Bernard hocks and spits after singing the line 'A small boy kneels, humble, in a great hall'.


Bernard realizes that their performance here is dire (in no small part due to the bottle of Pernod nearby) and starts improvising:

"This is a song called Ultraviolence
The crafty buggers(?) are full of shit"

ending with...

"Say no more, say no more..."

...there's other assorted niceties here I have to transcribe...

_Hurt_ and _Everythings___Gone___Green_ follow, the latter segueing into _Temptation_. All excellent.

Fade out/in back to the encore of _Blue___Monday_.

Apparently, Mr. Sumner was a no-show here, with Hooky and Slim handling vocal duties, with Hooky doing the first version and Slim continuing on. Quite unique.

About 7:00, Slim says something, but I can't make it out due to all the reverb.

NO: 12 APR 84 Trinity Hall - Hamburg

Various M/2 sources of the same source tape.

The tape has about 20 seconds of intro audience ephemera before the first song, _Age___Of___Consent_ is played. The tape garbles about a minute into the song.

"One, two, three, four"...and "Everything's Gone Green" are some of the interesting things that can be heard shouted out by punters, right before the martial drumbeats of _Denial_ pound their skulls into a pulp.

The same Kraut who yells at the start yells again in front of _Chosen___Time_.

More shout outs. The band has still not talked to the audience. _Thieves___Like___Us_ and _ICB_ follows.

BS: "Ed, try turning the compressor down a bit."

Somebody cries for "Transmission."

BS: "Turn the vocals back up a bit."


lyric: "Why don't you fuck off?"

Another shout out by the usual suspect, followed by a "one two three four" and a nice "untie your shoe, you twat!". Nasty feedback squall and guitar strum, in preparation for the instrument swapping that precedes _Confusion_.

punter: "Raise any [lads]...stand off, let's go!"

A/B split at this point.


The TJ version has about 11 seconds of drumming that the others don't.

A long break between songs, with the UK guy shouting on "C'mon, lads!"


BS: "Uh, this next one's a load of shite that we copied off Divine. It's called, eh, Blue Monday. Painful getting this fucking sequencer loaded."

The UK punter yells: "Must be pretty shite anyway!"

_Everythings___Gone___Green_ ends the set.

NO: 15 APR 84 Galactica - Luneburg

Copy thanks to TJ.

His notes:

picked up mid-84, can't remember trader's name. Reasonable show, funny version of Hurt. Annoying tape flip issue at very start of Village, and it sounds as though the taper missed the record button at the very start of Your Silent Face.


Song peters to an end with synths and guitar, and an interesting Hooky melody that I've only heard in between songs in their Joy Division days (notably after 'Digital' at Plan K, 17 JAN 1980)

BS: "Thank you...thank you very much."


A bit of feedback at a couple of points.

First bit of audience banter at 1:53 on the tape.


BS: "Thank you very much, I can see that you're easily, uh, bright to st...[stutters].. estasticism..." [?]

Segues into _Temptation_.

_586_ and _Lonesome___Tonight_ follow.


Tape flip cuts off a bit of the beginning of this song.


Hooky says something, probably in response to a banterer. I can't make it out.

BS: "Eh, let's all be here together in love and peace between all mankind. No drink, no sex, no drugs, we're just here enjoying ourselves."

A few seconds later.

BS: "Peace, love, and..." [can't make out last part]

Interesting lyrics by Barney. Wish I could make what he was rambling about.

Some heckling beteen songs, not all of it in German. I hear "Nazi!"

Since somebody recognizes (?) out there, come backstage after." And I then hear somebody saying "twat".

BS: "Thank you...[something, a few words] after that."

German lass says the band name.

_Blue___Monday_ ends the main set.

There's a cut, with _Your___Silent___Face_ being the encore.

"So why don't you FUCK off?"

Hooky ends it all with a long rubber-band like bass solo. There's a couple of seconds of post-gig venue music before the tape cuts.

NO: 14 MAY 84 Royal Festival Hall - London

Source is a tape from my archives, as well as an MP3 downloaded from Soulseek(?) derived from the same source, with the tape being much better quality.

Bernard notes, "Can't moan about us coming on late now." (missing from the MP3-downloaded version)


Early version, with a synth false start. Extended intro.

(see http://www.new-order.net/no/gigs/nogigs84.html#NO-840514.faceup for lyrics)

BS: "Thanks very much. That was a new song, we never played it before." (of course forgetting, intentionally or not, that the group *did* play it on 19 Mar 1984 at Caesar's Palace in Bradford)

_Everythings___Gone___Green_ segues into _Temptation_. There's a brief dropout within Barney's first verse of the latter (about six minutes in or so). Right before the "Oh, you got green eyes" bit, Hooky yells out, "And [??] happens when you all go out on strike!"


BS: "Alright, you're gonna start to get a majority vote on everything." (likely in reference to having audience yelling out what song to play next)

(and afterwards)

BS: "Thank you very much, that's dedicated to all the fat bastards in the audience."

Lots of cries for Ceremony. The Order perform _Your___Silent___Face_ instead. Bernard sings "why don't you...fuck up as..." (can't make out last word)

A good-sized pause between this and the next track, _Leave___Me___Alone_.

A couple of stereo field shifts, likely due to the taper moving around.


BS: "Why don't you all stand up? (cheers) It's only photographers that are allowed to stand up."

Terrific rendition.


BS: "This...this next song is all about hate."


PH: "Shhh...you've got a good band it's no one[?] to think. This is... eh, 'Coals For Newcastle'"

BS: "See...who said it was shit, eh?"


Debut performance!

PH: "Shhh..."

BS: "This one's a new song, it's called 'I've Got A Cock Like The M1'"

This has a different bass sequencer melody, a different bass riff, and the main keyboard melody is simpler.

(see http://www.new-order.net/no/gigs/nogigs84.html#NO-840514.tpk for lyrics)

Gillian hits the keyboard at the wrong time at one point.

BS: "Thanks very much." Another 20 seconds of repeated synth-based noise at the end.


PH: "Shhh...you know this encore is costing us, uh, four hundred quid, a bit more expensive than a fiver, innit?"

New Order than play _Decades_, which some feel was a practice run for the version they played at Paradiso.


Intro has a break different than the usual.

lyric: How does it feel when you _hurt_ me like you do?

Buuurp! Listen for it.

Other notes...

Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 09:43:04 +0100
From: "Steve Waller"
Subject: RE: (Fac33) Perfect Kiss

Jonathan is right. They first played it at Royal Festival Hall on May 14 1984 (I remember as it was my first NO gig). Next line was "It's long and thin and got a white line down it". They also did an early version of Face Up and Decades. The gig was a benefit for miners.

"...I may have posted something about this before,but, Perfect Kiss was first performed live in Woolwich, London in 1984 ..."

They were playing the track as "Kiss of Death" as early as June '84. I cannot check as I no longer have the legion of tapes I once had but remember them playing it at the Birmingham Powerhouse gig that month (the first I attended).


(indeed this is correct)


Quality of this is perhaps on par as the tape I have, maybe slightly worse. This is on CD, and is split into no less than 19 tracks!

  1. Instrumental runthrough of _Your___Silent___Face_. Glitch in 3:22 of my copy. Hooky starts "1-2"'ing at about 6:34, and continutes intermittently through the rest of the track. (14:10)
  2. Drum checking, mostly. (0:41)
  3. Bass sequencer for _Confusion_. Punter makes unintelligible comment at about 0:11. (0:22)
  4. Synth runthrough for KW1 again, funny-sounding intro and errant keyboard note. Track ends at 1:38 and then Barney makes comments, calling Hooky's name at one point. Hard to make out. (2:02)
  5. Third runthrough for KW1. Barney talks again at the end. (0:52)
  6. KW1 - Fourth runthrough. More drumchecking at 3:05. And in what is a somewhat rare occurance, Barney makes some suggestions (hard to make out here) to Gillian. (3:47)
  7. KW1 - Fifth runthrough. Bernard says, "All right..." (0:41)
  8. Bass sequencer for _Everythings___Gone___Green_, but not the usual one. Very interesting, and reminiscent of their '81 forays. (2:25)
  9. Hooky's bass starting in on _Age___Of___Consent_. Hooky says "1-2" at about 0:54, and then plays a different riff (Decades?), a whistle and somebody says "Yo!" (1:23)
  10. Hooky plays the _LWTUA_ bass riff! Ends at about a minute in. Some conversation and scuffling, and then more Decades-type notes, a bit more of LWTUA, and then a "1-2, 1-2". (1:48)
  11. Guitar riff for _The___Passenger_, and then a feedback squall at about 0:30, BS: "A little bit of bass guitar though the wedgies(?), Ed." And then a bit more of the Iggy Pop. (1:10)
  12. Guitar riffing for _Sister___Ray_, and then Barneyh speaks, followed by random riffing before the Velvet Underground tune picks up again. (1:17)
  13. Drums and bass sequencer for _586_, very briefly. Hooky makes a comment, and then Barney plays the _Hurt_ melody on melodica, with Hooky playing the bass riff a bit, a slight pause, and then drum and bass sequencer again with a bit of more Hooky. (1:33)
  14. Barney sounds fairly animated. Something about "bass player" and "soundcheck", Hooky replies, and Barney keeps on ranting as there's a bit more playing. (0:37)
  15. Bass sequencer and then Hooky on Hurt, followed by keyboards. Second try. (1:26)
  16. More Hurt bass sequencer, ending in drums and bass tailing off. Very short third try. (0:13)
  17. Starts off with Hooky 1-2'ing a bit, and then a variation on the Hurt melody until Hooky's bass comes in. BS: "...first time...like the last time(?)...". Fourth try. (0:45)
  18. Full run-through of Hurt, fifth try. Bernard talks a bit at 2:00 in. Cold stop. (4:56)
  19. The very first public airing of _The___Perfect___Kiss! It's an instrumental. Alas my copy has diginoise through this. (7:53)

Face Up 14 May 84 Royal Free Hall - London England

The first time I saw you I knew that it was true Your eyes were so green your words were so pure I felt my king[?] hit the floor
You were up and I was down
I fell right down to the ground
Another suicide, my eyes were closed
You hurt me like as if you were old

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you (x2) Knowing you like I used to do
To see the beauty and you were through

Always so good, always so fine
Always so good, yes that was mine
I said...
Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you...whoo! (reverb on last line)

For a long time now I've seen your face Seen your face, seen your face
For a long time now I've seen your face Seen your face, seen your face
You were so good when I met you
You were so good when I met you
My heart broke into several pieces that day My heart broke forever like that piece of [?]-dy

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you, Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you Knowing you like I used to do
You were so high, I was so low
You were so close, you put on heat
And my skin[?] wasn't clothes so nice

It wasn't the first time, it wasn't the last time It wasn't between your legs I bet you
It was your heart, it was your source
It was a bottle ...[two words]...
Your heart was cold, your eyes were bright It hit me like a blinding light

I would bet
I never felt touched by the same feeling I would bet I find it hard
To stretch...new sorrows
I would bet I find it hard
To forget you like yesterday
A long time now I've missed you so
That has left a great big hole
A long time now you fainted into
The darkness...I followed you far

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you, Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you Always so good, always so bad
Always so fine, always so cute
Always so good, always so bad
Always so, so, so, so, so hard

The Perfect Kiss (aka I've Got A Cock Like the M1) 14 May 84 Royal Festival Hall - London England

(lyric transcription based on 'Digital' Mike Garrity and 'twist's efforts)

I've got a cock, it looks like the M1
It's long and thin, it's got a white line down it It curls about, it curls about
There's crashes on, and service stations too

I've got a cock like the M1...like the M1...like the M1...

This is about a man called me and you
a night for us, just with you
Of all the things we need some now
Before the end comes to our home

This is the first time, this is the last time I saw you in front of my house
You had a shotgun, you had a knife
You shot(?) at me and killed my wife

How did you get your name in front of me? Cuz I found you like I knew I should
I won't get laid with them...cuz belsen was a gas...

Artificiality, artificiality, artificiality, Artificiality, artificiality, artificiality

I looked to the right I saw my ride
You saw me with her long legs
You said 'I am at last on my own'

its not your own fault....
its not your own fault....
its not your own fault....
its not your own fault....

NO: 17 MAY 84 Paradiso Amsterdam Netherlands

Source: MP3 on Anthology Part One in misc directory. Mislabelled as being from 12 Sep 87. Since then, I've received the full show on CD.

From http://worldinmotion.atinfopop.com/4/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=3334038731&f=9334038

A recollection from "vinz":

"Paradiso, Amsterdam: Curtis remembered! Saw the soundcheck, they played several JD songs during the gig (LWTUA, Decades) and during the soundcheck From safety to where... Also the fast version of Confusion was tried out several times during the soundcheck. First track announced as 'New Guitar One' later called Skullcrusher and w/out lyrics. Have also a tape of this gig."

_Skullcrusher_ aka Solitude.

This is the only extant version with lyrics.

Starts out with Hooky, then the drums kick in.

The lyrics, as best as I can transcribe, described by David Fox as "another great couplet, and why the scariest job on earth is doing New Order's sound", are as follows:

        I saw your face in this world to be born today
        We have entered the city of ours someday
        The light poured down on us from the sky today
        Oh, the light poured down on the ground on us today

        You saw your arms touch my thighs
        Turn the foldback like it was at the soundcheck!
        Turn the guitar up and turn the vocals up too!
        Oh I have never met a cunt like you!

        On the side to the ground we had such a long long time today
        We flew in from Manchester it wasn't that far away

        Death came from the sky above (x4)
        I said...Death came from the sky/


BS: "Thanks very much."

The echo on Hooky's "Soul"-cry extends it to about five seconds. After this song there's about a ten second pause.


My CD source has a dropout on the right channel between 2:40 - 3:15.

There's guitar tuning after this one's complete.


BS: "Thanks very much. To the Dutch group...I always liked you, especially the ones from Rotterdam." Not to be taken at face value given the reaction to them a couple of years prior.


Another version that features "the sun, the trees, and the afterbirth." More right channel dropouts at 2:13 and 4:14. Another pause between this one and the next track.


Hooky's intro bass part starts off in the wrong key! After a short while, the band comes to a halt, and Bernard utters the following:

BS: "I apologize for our bass player."

Another pair of dropouts, one at about 2:00 and again at 4:10. The "watching forever" bit is sung in a falsetto.

BS: "Thanks very much, good night."

In "homage" to Rotterdam, the band leave the stage, leaving the fans to shout out for "more", with lots of cheering and booing, after about a minute, the cheers overwhelm the boos, as New Order take the stage again.

BS: "Danke(?)...I was off for only a minute, eh...This is really Rotterdam, this is so much about you..." (I think that's what he's saying, anyway)


Has the WRL intro sample. Left channel dropout at about 2:30 and at 3:05. Major dropout at 4:35, and a loud whistle at 5:04.


A dropout at 1:05, a fairly long one. Comes back at 2:00

BS: "Listen punk, we're not fucking playing Blue Monday tonight because we played it the last time we were here".

Which of course leads them to play _Blue___Monday_.

The intro drum sequence sounds a bit different than normal. New Order leave the stage again (presumably, with the sequencer still going) and the fans naturally start booing again. The second break lasts about a minute and a half, although it could have been longer if there were edits.

MP3 (from New Order Anthology Part Two) source sounds like videotape, and 'crackles' throughout. This is the second (and last) time New Order peforms this Joy Division song (not counting soundchecks). This is an excellent rendition.


Help making this out would be appreciated for those who have a copy, this may be the statement what Jon ten Have says they weren't performing these songs for the audience, but in memory of Ian Curtis, though they dedicate the song to somebody named Raymond.

Here's what I have for Bernard's intro:

BS: "I mean, you horrible bastards, you don't deserve this, but we're not doing it for you, we're doing it for a friend of ours called Raymond."

The CD version has more dropouts at 3:20 and 6:03.


PH: "If you didn't deserve that, than you certainly don't fucking deserve this!", leading to a fairly raucous rendition of the JD classic. The second verse has Bernard almost inaudible in the mix, so as a consequence he sings very loudly. Massive feedback during the bridge, and the song comes to a close with a two note vamp and a refrain, and then a wall of feedback. This is as heartfelt a performance of Joy Division songs the band have ever put forth.

NO: 21 MAY 84 Palais - Leicester


Lady fan (who can be heard on certain other tapes) is giggling.

PH: "Good evening."

She says "Good evening" back.

Second time TPK is ever played. Instrumentation is similar to the debut at RFH a week before.

Starts out with "You gave me the perfect kiss, you gave me the kiss of death"...which is repeated quite a few times. No mention of cocks, however.

Lots of cheering as the Order stir up some _Confusion_, followed by _586_ and _Lonesome___Tonight_, followed by a bit of tuning and _Thieves___Like___Us_, and then _Ultraviolence_, all played without comment.


BS: "Sorry for not saying anything tonight, but I can't think of anything to say."

Segues into _Temptation_.

punter/taper: "W...da...Bang(?)...it's not real!"

_Age___Of___Consent_ and _In___A___Lonely___Place_ close out the set.

NO: 25 MAY 85 'Pop Elektron' - German TV

New Order talk about the origins of the title of "Thieves Like Us" before playing it live.

Gillian in green plaited skirt, Hooky in his leather jacket, Barney in a white t-shirt and blue jeans, Stephen's in a frilly shirt with a stripe down the left side.

NO: 03 JUN 84 Powerhouse - Birmingham

Snotters' description:

> 3 songs from Movement played; the debut of Perfect Kiss "mk. 2" > (as opposed to the radically different "mk. 1" arrangement) > the hilarious interplay between Barney and an abusive punter at the > beginning of Perfect Kiss Hooky's superb "tribute" to the club DJ


Sound cuts out at 0:33, like somebody unplugged a lead (snotters)

Then the sound goes pear-shaped white noise-y between 4:19-4:22. That's not a fault of the recording but of the PA, as other versions of this recording also suffer from this.

BS: "Thanks very much."

_The___Village_ and _Chosen___Time_ follow.

(end of the latter)

BS: "It's raining.""

Volume fades down a bit and then back up. (snotters)


[Snotters version] Another sound gremlin at 0:50 or thereabouts. Sound distorts between 1:30 and 1:45, and again between 2:10-2:45. Small glitch at 3:50.

After Bernard says, "Why don't you FUCK off"...he then mutters something like "head paste".

Barney tunes his guitar after they finish.


Morris is drumming his arms off. More distortion between 2:15 - 2:20.

Quite a bit of shouting between this one and _Denial_

More Morris on speed. He is a drumming deity.

Lots more shouts out. Steve even bangs the drums once more. :)


Neat sound effects starting at 4:15. At 4:35 there's an edit which sounds like the sound crinkling.


Before the start, somebody cries out for 'Too Late', which gets a chuckle from the stage.


Tape garbles a bit between 1:00 - 1:10.

Another long gap with punters shouting out.


Thanks go to Snotters for the help with the interplay betwixt Barney & the hapless punter, as well as to the exchange between Hooky and the DJ.

BS: "Diane, turn the foldback up a little bit please?"

Punter yells at Barney to "fuck off".

BS: "You fuck off, you big tit."

Cheers. Then someone shouts out "wanker".

BS: "In fact, you're a cunt, not a tit."

More cheers.

BS: "Or you're a bollock-brain, not a cunt. And if you want a fight I'll see you in the dressing room afterwards."

This is, as Snotters notes, the debut of the modern arrangement of TPK, but it's still different enough to the release to be interesting to listen to. The main synth line has a different tone. And the frogs!

New Order head off the stage, and there's a tape break. When the tape resumes, there's some reggae/dub-type music over the PA.

DJ: "I don't know if you'd get anymore, but if you want some, you better shout for it."

So folks shout for it.

The DJ then plays the opening bars to _Blue___Monday_ but then stops it, to loud booing. The reggae music comes back on. There's another break at 1:37, resuming with more music.

And then New Order come back on, with what has to be one of the most memorable exchanges to come from the band (between tracks, anyway):

PH: "So we've only come back on to tell the fucking DJ what a fucking dickhead he is, all right?"

DJ: "That works two ways then, doesn't it, you know? They want more, just give it to 'em."

PH: "Why don't you fuck off. Mind your own fookin' business."

The crowd is well riled up at this point, and a couple of punters hurl insults out while the band soundcheck their instruments.

[snotters recording]

punter #1: "Fucking Sylvester"
punter #2: "Sieg Heil"
punter #1: "Wanker!"
punter #2: "Bring back Ian Curtis!"


BS: "Can we have, er, a moment of silence, for uh, respect. Please be nice to us."

Of course, the track starts right off.

Bernard then cries for the sequencer to be turned up.

NO: 04 JUN 84 Palais - Nottingham, England

Source: MP3s downloaded from Soulseek. 128k CBR. Sound is very good.

_The___Perfect___Kiss_ is about 90% like the FAC123 version, but with a more "tropical" beat, and slightly different bass riffs, with no outro Hooky vamp.

BS: "Shut up".

A few seconds later, he gives an instruction to "turn the foldback down".

"I know, you know, we believe in the chosen few..." is the chorus.

_Ceremony_ follows.

Really punchy version of _Hurt_.

A few seconds between this and the next one, _We___All___Stand_.

At the start, Barney calls out, "Callup me" (or something that sounds like that). Then they segue right into _Leave___Me___Alone_, which ends with a two-note Hooky styling.

BS: "Thank you very much. Very much appreciate you turning up tonight."


BS: "Love is the cure for every organ..." (lyric)


BS: "Er, this next song might cause a little confusion for once. Funny, eh? Don't laugh!"

Really pleasant high pitched two or three note refrain in the background that I haven't heard elsewhere.

_Everythings____Gone___Green_ segue into _Temptation_.

Punter yells out "Keep trying!" as there's a couple of equipment noises before the track emerges. Interesting intro drum rhythm. This is a true combo version, at about 5:00 EGG transforms into Temptation. Barney says "A-B-C-D" instead of the typical "1-2-3-4". Right in the middle of the "Bolts from above" mantra, Barney yells, "Turn the fucking synthesizer up!" when Gillian obediantly does.


Dunno if this was played as the encore, likely that it was.

Features the same drum machine sound that TPK does (at the 1:00 mark, anyway). Sounds like Bernard's mic cuts out at 2:48, on the "past until completion" line.

The track ends in a harsh analogue synth line.

NO: 05 JUN 84 Studio - Bristol

Recording courtesy of TJ.


BS: "The new song is, uh, Thieves Like Us. Oh."

Mic on recorder is getting bumped while he says this.

female voice: "Did you(?) see now. Thank you. Sorry!"

(same voice that appears on some other '84 era recordings like Chippenham and Portsmouth)

This is a short (3:45) version.


Synth noise at the start is in a different pitch than wont.


Some pops/stereo shifts from 0:28 - 0:32, not sure if they're present in the source tape.

_Chosen___Time_ follows.

Very neat filter effect at the end of this.


Accidentally mixes in the staccato beat of Blue Monday at the start.

BS: "New version of...uh, Your Silent Face."

lyric: "So why don't you fuck off, twatface."

BS: "Andy, can you give us a bit more light on stage, we can't see what we play."

_ICB_ follows.

An early version of _Face___Up_ is up next, about the fifth or sixth time they played but it still has 'scratch' lyrics.

An example.

lyrics: "First time that I saw your face, I thought it was a shitty... Your chin was long, your noise was large, your bottom was like fucking garage(?)" etc.

_586_ follows.

Cut in tape at this point.


BS: "Thank you so much, nice to be here in Birmingham."

Bristol is Birmingham?

BS: "Keep all your rubbish off the stage, please."


This version sounds mostly like the release version, but is different enough to be interesting.

House music starts playing afterwards, and Bernard and co. come back on stage.


BS: "Be quiet please, I want to announce that we're moving forward(?). The day afterwards."

Doesn't make any sense.

This segues into _Temptation_, which features sampled frogs at the end.

Another encore.


BS: "And we're just waiting for our sequencers to load up as we don't use tapes at all."

At end.

BS: "I'm afraid we don't have...[something can't make out]...for.

NO: 27 JUN 84 The Mayfair - Southampton

From Brynn: "Regarding the above gig , which I went to, unfortunately I remember
very little apart from a few technical problems, but I do remember that the support band were an Australian band called 'The Scientists', remember buying their album a few days after the gig , still have today!"

Made available by IP Freely. A superior version surfaced through TMK.

Mike adjustment sounds from the taper and Bernard plucking his bass before the start of _Confusion_. The sound fluctuates a bit in the first minute as the soundman adjusts the mix.

At about 1:37 Bernard chants, "Roadie has my bass drum." and cries out "DMX" at 1:50.

BS: "Thanks very much."


Hooky's intro basswork is very odd, to say the least.

EGG segues into _Temptation_.

A bit of feedback through Bernard's first verse.

BS: "Thank you very much."

_Your___Silent___Face_ is next.

Bernard sings, "You've asked what you've seen, you said...'Fuck off'!" which he repeats a bit later on by itself.

At the end, it sounds like he says, "Amuse yourself, please."

_Lonesome___Tonight_ follows.

Hooky twangs his bass at the very end.

BS: "Hello everybody, it's so nice of you all to be here tonight with us."

And a few seconds later, in response to a particularly loud heckler.

BS: "Shut your mouth, shitface. I don't mean all of you, I just mean him."


During the intro, one of the synth sounds like it packed up.

More shouting and squabbling amongst the punters.


Unique stuttering drum intro here, sounding like that of Blue Monday's.

lyric: "I have you at home tonight / You were such a stupid cow."

and "I've heard it all before, I've heard it all before / I've heard two in '64."

As well as other improvised lyrics. Hooky vamps over the latter part of the song, playing brilliantly here.


BS: "Well, we've made a mistake on that one. Just to prove that we don't use tape recorders. Who notices a few bum notes, eh?"

(TJ's version missing first line of above)

Hooky plays the opening bass riff to the song, stops, and then starts up again.

_The___Perfect___Kiss_ follows, with quite an unusual (and excellent) opening.

At 4:36, Bernard sings, "I know it's so good / I know it's so bad", which unfortunately wasn't retained for the final release.

A nearly ten-minute epic. Amazingly good. Hooky's outro bass morphs into the intro bass line to the next song, which makes its debut at this gig.


The lyrics hadn't been fully formed, at some point, I'll make an attempt to transcribe them.

NO: 01 JUL 84 Roskilde Festival - Roskilde, Denmark

Thanks to TJ for identifying LWTUA from a compilation of songs I had at the end of another recording, detailed below.

Sounds like it was mastered from LP, sounds harsh, direct, and raw.

On the tape that I have with these songs, Everything's Gone Green (taken from 22 JUN 82) appears after LWTUA, followed by We All Stand (taken from 12 MAR 83)

Subsequently, 'booomboom' from STG posted this gig, in excellent quality, so I'm able now to do a full writeup. A few tracks were also videotaped.


("love and death" version)

Has scratch lyrics, but more developed than in some August gigs they played this at.

See http://www.new-order.net/no/gigs/nogigs84.html#NO-840701.sunrise for a transcription.

There's some crackling and PA music before the Order proceed into _Dreams___Never___End_.

_Ceremony_ follows.

(at the finish)

BS: "Can you, eh, turn the guitar down and foldback a little bit please, it's feeding back, because it's coming through the foldback."

Hooky then says "Shut up, twatface."

_The___Village_ is next.


BS: "Go ahead and move about...[sequencer stops]...why don't you move about a bit, you buhch of flag-waving bastards" [loud guitar strum obscures the rest of what he says]

PH: "Will you turn the bass drum, Andy, down on the side fill...that's what we need you for, Andy."

[Bernard plucks bass, and then the sequencer starts up again]


A bit of a pause here.

PH: "Lou Reed, eat your heart out!"

(Lou Reed had played in Roskilde the day before, I guess the band had gotten a chance to meet him and they didn't exactly hit it off, but that is just a guess, if anybody knows for sure, let me know)

Bass synth is phat and juicy here.

Song ends in wash of guitar plucks.


PH: "C'mon, don't get impatient, we've been here for three fucking days."


A very long pause.

PH: [off-mic, shouting somebody's name twice]

BS: "Don't shout, you youngster."

(at about 0:50)

BS: "What we're doing now is waiting for our, erm, sequencer to load."

PH: "There's a deaf comic shouting for Joy Division...fucking hell. There's only a couple naked who've got sore throats."

Instead of singing, "He took his final breath, now I know the perfect kiss is the kiss of death", Bernard hums the vocal melody.

The median synth melody appears to be played live by Gillian and is pretty bad. Frogs appear in here, perhaps for the first time.

(at the end)

BS: "Thank you very much, that was called Perfect Kiss, that's, uh, a new song."

_Age___Of___Consent_ is performed next, with _Temptation_ following.


The refrain "How does it feel when your heart grows cold?" is repeated several times in quite a unique fashion.

BS: "Thanks very...thanks...thank you very much. At least the beat...[?]"

Barney chokes on one of the lines.

There's a video of a portion of this song, which is a grainy, shaky single camcorder shot from the audience that films more of the punters than the band! The sound on this is mono, but fairly good.


BS: "Thank you very much...you deserve it!"

BS: (cough) "We're gonna play a Paul Young number now for all of you people who wanted to see Paul Young."

(correction courtesy of Shug of NOOL...this also appears on certain versions of the 1987-08-26 Pier 84 show) as a 'bonus track')

The video also captures some of LWTUA as well, including freaky dancing in the mud, and Barney stumming away like a madman at the end, and folks chanting and whistling for an encore.

New Order than come back on after the encore, there's an instrumental bit starting with the bass synth, and then with Morris firing off a few bars, and a Hooky's bass contributing to a jam I've not heard before.

Hooky says something, a bit of which I can't make out.

PH: "We're gonna let that slide before we [two words], if that's all right, the fans are right."


Unknown sequence at the start, it sounds quite a bit like the untitled song/jam played during the 81-84 rehearsals!

The intro synth portion is the same, with exception of the drum pattern.

Ben Rose helps with making sense of it:

"Said gig has always been one of my very favorites, and the Face Up is absolutely spectacular. I think the lyrics, at least at the beginning, are:

I've know you for such a long time now You have always been such a DIRTY cow Your tits were big and your cunt is thick From your cunt I'll always track (?)
Your tits were like wild strawberries (????) (garbled)

I'd like to fuck you, etc.

Hope that's helpful. I'm pretty sure of all of them, save for the question marked ones. If you or anyone else can figure out the lines, I would love to have the info because I think they're absolutely hilarious. Barney at his worst/finest."

BS: "Thank you....very much."


BS: "The next song is a [echo obscures this word] song called, 'While Hopped Up'" (I suspect the song name is really in Danish, that sounds like what he's saying, though)

Right before the second verse, the video colors go inverted.

It sounds like he gets a case of the woo-cups here. :_)

Barney sings "so why don't you FUCK OFF, you pathetic twat?".

Sunrise 01 Jul 84 Roskilde Festival, Denmark

You've kept me waiting for a long time now I've known you for so many years, I've grown tired of you You were cold, I was hot, our hair was blue Long time, no, I felt my heart belong to you

Oh, love, death, love and death
Love and death and love and death
Your love and death and love and death
Your love and death, woo!

You've kept me waiting for such a long time now Oh, our heart has never been...everything...this way You've told me that you love me but it wasn't true But I wish I had nothing else to do with you

Oh, your love and death, love and death Love and death and love and death
Your love and death and love and death
Love and death and love and death, woo!

You told me that I was...such a long... Your hair was..., your eyes were green
Guess with you I have always been
I've known you for a long time now
I've a big boy, you're such a cow
Well, right now, you're a two-faced stink You think you just want a drink

Love and death, love and death
Love and death, love and death
Love and death, love and death
Love and death...

NO: 04 JUL 84 - Rock-Ola, Madrid

See the following entry for the convoluted history about the venue/ setlist.

The mystery has been solved. In fact, both nights were at the Rock-Ola, see here for the proof:


Here's the original (incorrect, it seems) setlist for this gig:

Thieves Like Us
Dreams Never End
Sooner Than You Think
Leave Me Alone
Your Silent Face
Everything's Gone Green

NO: 05 JUL 84 - Rock-Ola, Madrid

James Thomas writes (on NOOL):

"I've just been reading Cabaret Voltaires tour dates in Spain '84. http://www.brainwashed.com/axis/cv/live.htm

05.07.84 Etole, Madrid, Spain
with New Order

06.07.84 Pacha Auditorium, Valencia, Spain (was mistakenly listed as Palma Club) with New Order

07.07.84 Studio 54, Barcelona, Spain
with New Order

10.07.84 Marbella TV Studio, Spain
with New Order

12.07.84 Pacha, Valencia, Spain
with New Order

This last date doesn't appear on this site or Waterrat and the forum search hasn't thrown anything up. Is this an error?"

TJ replies:

"Yes it's a mistake. The Pacha and the Palma are the same venue, and it was the first date listed when they played (I have a scan of the ticket).

Here's where the mystery deepens though. About a year ago, Spotnick at NOOL had a mail from a Spanish guy saying that the entry on the gigography for Madrid Rock-ola was wrong, that he had been at the gig, and the gigography it had the wrong date and that the setlist was totally incorrect, that the gig at the Rock-ola had been on the 4th of July, they had opened with Thieves Like Us, and that only one of the songs listed against that entry had been played. This Spanish correspondent said that they did Thieves/ICB/DNE/STYT/Leave Me Alone/KW1/Ultrav/Conf/EGG/Sunrise.

I did some digging, and it appears as though they may have actually done two gigs in Madrid, one at the Rock-ola and one at another venue, and the tape we have is actually from the other venue but has been confused with the Rock-ola show. That would mean that there is another Madrid gig out there we don't have a recording from, and we don't know the correct venue for the show we do have!"

Update: the mystery has been solved. In fact, both nights were at the Rock-Ola, see here for the proof:


NO: 06 JUL 84 Pacha Auditorium - Valencia, Spain

From JB's writeup of the DIME seed:

"The day before the perfect gig (Barcelona '84 - not to be missed, especially the drewc-remaster), this concert wasn't too bad, either. Starting off with a rare outing of "The Him", it also features the standard (for that point in time) EGG-Temptation pairing and an ultra-cool Ultraviolence. The early rendition of "The Perfect Kiss" that closes the proceedings may be riddled by equipment failure at the start, but the band manage to overcome the gremlins and work their way to a perfect climax at 7'07"!!

65 minutes condensed into 12 FLAC-files that amount to 435 MB. This audience recording was yet again provided by TJ; it merits an Agrading. The tape flip occurred between Thieves Like Us and Ultraviolence; the dying keyboard at the end of TLU is abruptly cut short and the very beginning of Ultraviolence is also missing. The Him cuts in after the opening bars, but other than that the recording is complete."


Only played two times thereafter.

This version just ends at the point where the band do a near-stop and resume the song.


(at end)

BS: "Thank you very much."


They do this one to plenty of cheering at the end, followed by scattered applause and whistling as the Order get ready for one of their _Everythings___Gone___Green_ into _Temptation_ segues.


Bernard's singing is at a higher register than wont for this one.

_Thieves___Like___Us follows. Quick fade-out of tape.


Quick fade-in.

Great riff near the end, too bad this ends so soon.


The usual drum-murder workout.


At the 2:00 mark:

Bernard sings "no colors, just silence", and then declaims "Down...[couple of words lost to reverb]". Then "The rise and fall of shame" followed by "Down!"

There's a lot of drum sequencer soundchecking in between the main set and the encore track, which is a nearly developed version of _The___Perfect___Kiss_.

NO: 07 JUL 84 Studio 54 - Barcelona, Spain

Waterrat's listing is *missing* the final two tracks, which are Everything's Gone Green and Temptation. They were apparently not included in the original FM broadcast. EGG apparently segues into Temptation.

Have a video of Ceremony and the last three tracks performed at that concert. The most noteworthy thing being that Barney performed topless! Not to mention that his '84-era "new wave mullet", dyed blonde streaks is not to be missed!

It's too bad the quality of the video is fairly poor, but the audio portion is fine.

Also, the version of "Hurt" was labelled in the video as "Cramp", odd considering that as the B-side of Temptation, and had been in New Order's set since November 1981, with the last time that song being played was on 27 Feb 1986 in Wolverhampton.

Barney's riffing during the ending of Age of Consent is frentic.

Writeup, from outstanding quality CD source.


One word. Amazing. And it's just the opener.


The sequence of the lyrics is very different than the LP version. The high pitched wooing is also notable.


This is the version that made Retro (if you believe that latter's tracklisting). I haven't done a comparison to find out if the Retro track had been remixed, but I suspect that it has.


A few seconds of guitar plucking before Skullcrusher lands like a ton of bricks.

Here's a transcription of Skullcrusher: http://www.new-order.net/no/gigs/nogigs84.html#NO-840707.skull

The scratch lyrics include a couplet that close out Face Up:

"Your hair was black, your eyes were blue/ Guess what I'm gonna do to you!"

There's a few seconds of silence between this and the next track.


BS: "The next song needs thinking about a lot...but eventually starts..."

Then follows Lonesome tonight...with a drawn out Hooky bass intro.


Barney calls out "hi hat" during one of the "you just won't believe" me lines about a minute in. The live mix is strange, deemphasizing the main synth lines over the other electronics and stringed instruments. Ends with a few bass notes from Barney.

_Hurt_ and _Age___Of___Consent_ follow. Bernard's vocals are a bit buried during the latter. Stunningly good, both.

Don't know quite what to make of _Blue___Monday_, though. The Roland 808 doing percussion during the first bit (if that's what it is) is an interesting touch.

Interesting thirty second improvisation between this and the next track, Hooky *almost* tantalizes us with the bassline of Love Will Tear Us Apart...then they get into _Everythings___Gone___Green_, with a fierce echoed "Show me!" as emotional keystone...seamlessly segueing into _Temptation_.

Skullcrusher 07 JUL 84 Studio 54 - Barcelona, Spain

I saw you watching here for today at me I saw you keeping eyes all free
You heard me calling with that voice of mine You felt that we were pure together

You heard me when I called you fat
You said that I was just a twat
Oh, your tits are big and your bunny(?) smells so bad I'm not sure I wish I was your dad

Your hair was black and you eyes were blue Guess what I'm going to do to you!
Oh, your mouth...the fact that you paid(?) I'm going to fuck you up to pieces(?)...all insane

You told me and I told you
We are gonna put it through
You told me and I told you
You told me and I told you

NO: 10 JUL 84 Marbella Estadio Municipal - Marbella, Spain

Source: Lars Nellemann's Anthology MP3 collection. Has distortion consistent with overly aggressive noise reduction.

Don't know if there are more than the five tracks listed.


My version has a cut at about 4:00 in.


Spanish announcer talks though the start, making the below quote only an approximate attempt to ascertain what's actually being said.

BS: "I'd like you take the bass off the wedgies, Ed."

Guitar intro is badly out of tune. About 1:30 in, there's a fair bit of distortion, but no cut outs.


During the intro, Bernard yells (presumably) at Steve to slow down.

Volume drops about 2:00 in.


Spanish announcer talks at start, but not over Bernard this time, thankfully.

BS: "Thanks very much everybody. We're very grateful."

Hooky calls out, "Ready?".

There's a cut at the start (about 0:30).

Bernard's vocal seem more expressive than is wont.

There's a cut-out at about 6:25 in. Announcer comes in at the end, which is edited after a couple of seconds.


PH: "Hey, let's go!"

BS: "This one is for our promoter, Emilio, the best fucking promoter in the entire world. Hey, Emilio!"

This is the third time NO have played this. Most of the lyrics are there but appear in different sequence or with different phrasing. This song has a cut near the end (about 6:30).

NO: 11 AUG 84 De Panne Seaside Festival - De Panne, Belgium

Very good recording.

This features the full classical-type into NO were using in the 84-85 time period, only really heard on the Japanese '85 gigs.

Near the end of the instrumental intro.

BS: "...two"

PH: "Volume up"


Unusual kick drum sound, and a very hollow bass sound. At about 3:30 the sound clears up a bit as I assume whoever's in front of the recorder moves out, but soon afterwards, it goes back to the state it was before.

_Ceremony_ follows.

Bernard says something at the end I can't make out.


Some chanting afterwards.


BS: "Thanks very much."

Feedback squall.

BS: "Can anyone fix this stupid fucking mikestand. Anybody got a screw?"

_The___Him_ and _Thieves___Like___Us_ follow.

The latter ends with the descending keyboard line, like on the record, instead of Hooky's usual bassplay.

A bit of riffing after _Everythings___Gone___Green_. Midway through the song (about 2:15) Bernard yells out something (probably to his soundman) that's buried in reverb.


At 1:14, Bernard calls out for high-hat and sequencers down, if I can make out what he's saying.

lyric: "Con-fucking-fusion".


Another break in tape right at the start of Hooky's starting riff. It seems at this point the sound quality of the source improves, or it's taken from a different recording, with about a minute or so cut.

Another edit before _Sunrise_. This version still features the in-progress lyrics, with "It goes up/it goes down/it goes up and down".

It sounds like the tape slows down. Another edit.


Tape still sounds like it runs slow here.

Bernard says something I can't make out after "It's no joke".

And features a "last fucking time".

NO: 12 AUG 84 Inside Festival - Halles des Forge, Liege Belgium

JB's notes:

"From a fantastic festival line-up that also included Shriekback, Fad Gadget and Echo & The Bunnymen, here's a fair audience recording of New Order's performance (don't know who were the headliners). The band was in very good spirits that night (check out Bernard's notable quotable prior to The Perfect Kiss!) and played a very long set. Interesting to note is that The Perfect Kiss starts with a minute-long synth drone while the sequencers were loading up AND that at least one punter can be heard in the crowd calling out the song title, which means that it was already known by that name among the hardliners at this point in time!! (Bernard Sumner also mentions the song title, but after the punter's yell).

The final song of the recording is a rendition of Sister Ray allegedly played by both New Order AND the Bunnymen (and not just Ian McCulloch alone on vocals). At least, this much can be gathered from The Bunnymen Concert Log 1984 (http://www.angelfire.com/wy2/setlists/page5.html), where it says: "We did 'Sister Ray' one time in Belgium with [New Order]. Me and Barney sang and there were eight people on the stage. We only taught them 'Sister Ray' five minutes before that encore." - Ian McCulloch (talking a load of rubbish, of course, as the band knew the song already from their Joy Division days). To me, it's not clear whether this performance was the encore of the NO- or the Bunnymen-set; all I can say is that the sound quality is different (inferior) compared to the rest of the set. Legendary is the debate among NO fans on various internet discussion forums regarding the identity of the "Willy" Bernard can be heard singing about during the song (Google yields no less than 2,530,000 hits for new order willy!). Some have claimed that it's a loose adaptation of the Velvet Underground's "Lonesome Ferryboat Bill", prompted by Bernard's seafaring interests which go back a long time. Others insist that it's one of Bernard's typical improvised ramblings about one of their roadies. Me, I think he's singing about another "member" of their entourage, but you be the judge yourselves, after listening to this recording. Enjoy!"

A bit of audience chatter before the first tune, including a comment about Joy Division.


BS: (during intro, about 1:15 in): "Some keyboards, Ed."

BS: (at about 1:45): "Some fucking synth now."

A bit of talking from the punters throughout.

BS: (at about 4:42): "For God's sake, turn the vocals up!"

More chatter through the intro of _Procession_.

BS: "Eddie, the guitar's not in tune(?), if you can turn it down a little bit."

PH: "One two, can you turn me down Eddie, please, in the front and in the side."


More audience chatter at the end, including a cry for "Leave Me Alone".


Early version, still having the "knowing you like I used to do" line in the chorus.

BS: "It's all right, lad, just turn down the vocals a little bit."


(at end)

BS: "Pretty [few unintelligible words]....put it this way, Ozzie, it's good that you lost it."


Bernard cries "sequencer" in between lines (and breaths), at about 1:10.

Tape edit in between songs.


(at end)

BS: "Eddie, baby, you should be...guitar...these." (can't quite make this out)


Segues into _Temptation_.

Main set closes out with _Blue___Monday_.

lyric: "If it wasn't for your misfortune, I'd be a fucking cool bastard today."

Bernard then breaks out into spontaneous potty-verse.

BS: "I said yes, I said yes, you bastard, you bastard. Mothers, tits, assholes, cunts, mothers, tits, assholes, cunts."

Fans clap, and then start booing and shouting during the first encore break.

BS: "This one's a song called A Perfect Kiss, it's a new song...and it goes like this, we like to please you, not to tease you."

BS: "I'm just...sequencers blowing up."

_The___Perfect___Kiss_ starts out with an extended bass sequencer drone.

BS: "Sorry about the slight delay...it's not working, Ozzie!"

(at end)

BS: "Thank you very much, we deserve it!"


Ian McCulloch on vocals.

This begins the first in a long line of memorable profanity-laden stream-of-consciousness lyrical turns for this song performed live by New Order.

Fades out with punters chanting, "We want more, we want more..."

NO: 15 AUG 84 The Mayfair Suite - Sunderland

Source taken from Dreams Never End site. 128k MP3. Sound is fair to good, this is probably a few generations off the master judging from the amount of tape hiss.

I also have this on cassette, which is likely a dub of the following:


This source misses The Village and 5-8-6.


BS: "One two." (missing on the KL version)

Impressive bass synth notes on what I presume is the intro tape, right before Face Up starts, with an extended intro. About 1:20 in, the tape dynamics change (like somebody removed some EQ or took off Dolby B) and treble/hiss make their appearance. At 1:45 the bass kicks in.

The improv is like the other developmental versions, but features the couplet:

"Your hair was blue and your eyes were green/ Guess where we never have been"

Any additional help with lyrics transcription would be appreciated.

Nice bass/drum break at 4:15...as well as "for a long time now I have seen your face" downbeat bridge vocal.

Outro bass riff very different than the release version.


BS: "Eddie, some more guitar from the side fill..."

Lots of chanting to the melody. This is a very abbreviated version, Bernard starts in during the opening keyboard riff.

A bit of a right channel drop at around 2:50 on the KL version.

BS: "Thanks very much". A bit of chatter by those around the taper.


Bernard is having problems with his mic and vocals...first lines cut off and singing "won't you please let me know..." in entirely too high a register. Classic!


There's some loud squeaking that might be a guitar-based noise. The fans chant along to the keyboard riff. Instead of "piss off", Barney says "fuck off".


We hear a tiny bit of strumming before the Order start in.

BS: "Hello everyone it's _good_ to be here..." (the recorded version has _nice_)

There are quite a few other differences with respect to the vocal phrasing in the first stanza.

The chorus is "You know that we love you/Yes we do" instead of "You know what I mean/Yes you do"


I think Barney says something about the lights, but it's hard to make out.

This song was to be played only two more times after Sunderland.


BS: "Right lads. We _think_ the sequencer's broke. We think we need the other one."

Cut at 3:13 on the KL source.


Fans call for Procession. Some dropouts at the start of this track on the KL version.


BS: "We're going to try a new song. We might get it right."



A couple of sequencer blips before the track starts up. Still a bit different than the released version, even if it's mostly been worked out.

Punters chant, "Here we go, Here we go..."


BS: "We already played Blue Monday. We're never going to play it again! I'm sick to death of that song."

Hooky adds a bass bit he usually does before Confusion...of course the Order go ahead and play it anyway, to great fan delight.


The foyer of the Mayfair Suite - a large grey box on concrete stilts just a few hundred yards away from two massive half-finished oil tankers on the banks of the Wear - could be that of a Mecca ballroom almost anywhere in Britain.

The Decor is the ultimate in sophisticated tack, bouncers roam the deep read carpets in dinner jackets and ties and the clientele are offered the opportunity to alternate pints of 'heavy' with hamburger supper at the food bar upstairs.

But tonight's crowd are not the kind that would usually frequent such a place. Tonight is the opening night of New Order's most extensive British 'tour' to date; eight concerts already announced with others being added as the Smiths Of Sheffield transit hurtles south towars such rock kernels as Margate, Chippenham and Gloucester.

With over 1,000 tickets sold in advance and a couple of hundred on the dour the venue is comfortably full if not exactly buzzing with tense anticipation. The fans arrive in ones and twos, the dress casual without the capital C. The hardcore element are identified not by black leather or green canvas, but by the portable cassette recorders tucked surrepitiously under the arm.

Debbie, 15, from Hartlepool is there "just to say I've been" and also in the hope that more bands will visit the town if this concert is well supported. Her friend Sharon is less enthusiastic: "I think they're a bunch of miserable bastards, but I'd go and see any band that play in Sunderland on a Wednesday night. We haven't had anyone here since Musical Youth."

The couple in identical Wayfarer shades (in a place _this_ dark?) are more partisan, being committed fans who have travelled up from Teeside. He sees the whole thing as a carry-on from Joy Division. She likes the lyrics and the "depressing" sound: "The whole legend that surrounds them obviously has a lot to do with their appeal, and the death of Ian Curtis just perpetuated the myth. But we've just come for the music."

Joanne, 20, came "because I like seeing new bands and I heard this lot on the radio and they sounded good." Keith 22, thinks that 45-minute, non-encore sets are disrespectful to the audience. His friend John, 19, brings up the supposedly fascist undertones of the band name only to add that he thinks any such allegations are totally unfounded.

Barry, 23, has been following the group since JD days and admits slight disappointment at the music they are making now: "I'm not really that heavily into the dance stuff. They also seem to be more poppy now, but they're still good musicians. They're still one of the few groups worth bothering about. They keep on the outside of things, so you're always wondering what they're really about and the only way to do that is really through the lyrics. They appeal to me for what they do."

Richard, 24 and sporting a mop of unruly blond hair, is more succinct: "They're a heavy metal band who can't play...but they're a good heavy metal band that can't play."

In the event, Richard is wrong. New Order have played some truly leaden, stuttering messes of live sets in their time, but when they are at their best there are few to touch them. They possess a muscularity that is almost awesome but marry it to a textural and emotional range that still cajoles and suprises their audience.

They open with a newish song that should be the next single. Having only heard it once before at the recent Miners' Benefit in London, it could be called 'I Cannot Stand The Very Thought of You' although will probably turn up as 'Obsession' or something equally enigmatic. [of course, the author is referring to 'Face Up']. Whatever, it is simply superb, a perfects sequel to the explosive pop rush of 'Temptation'. This rhythm and dynamism is the closest rock music comes to a racing pulse.

The song sets the tone for the first part of the set, the group rushing through 'Thieves Like Us', a rigourous quartet of tracks from 'Power, Corruption, And Lies' and even 'ICB' of 'Movement'. This music is far from cold or clinical, its raw intensity and drive one of the few remaining live rock noises that is positively uplifting.

One of the slightly more dubious characteristics of a New Order set rears its head as the group move on to unrecorded pieces like 'You Know We Love You'(?), which at the moment consists of little more than the 'title' phrase repeated endlessly over a rather old-fashioned jam. New Order, by virtue of their naturalness, are not perfectionists and have long made a habit of dubting half-formed songs, It's an interesting ploy, but one that doesn't always come off. As singer Barney remarks in one of his limted audience-asides, "We're going to try a new song now, we might get it right..." [This song is 'Sooner Than You Think'].

And the new pieces are liberally splattered towards the end of the set, 'I Thought I Knew You' ['Sunrise'] being powerfully physical with more than a hint of an old JD bassline and 'Have Some Sun' ['The Perfect Kiss'] developing the polyrhythmic dance sensibility of the group's flirtation with New York hip hop.

And what of 'Blue Monday'? As the Mayfair breaks into a massed chorus of 'Howay The Lads' - the North-East's answer to Scotland's 'Here We Go, Here We Go' - Barney returns to the lip of the stange and informs them that the group no longer perform that particular opus.

"We're never going to play that song again. In fact we're sick to death of it!"

By now, the rest of the group are onstage, plugging in their instruments and beginning to tune up again. New Order no longer "don't do encores", of course, and within seconds are into the opening bars of 'Blue Monday'.

The joke was probably on Barney.

NO: 16 AUG 84 City Hall - Hull

This writeup only encompasses the soundcheck for this gig, as well as a transcription of a review. Writeup for gig itself is forthcoming.


The portion I have is only about 9:19 long. It was unlabelled on the source cassette, but the timing and playlist seem to match with the given date on the Waterrat listing. The levels on the recording are extremely loud.

Here's the itinerary:

0:00 Drums for KW1
3:20 Keyboards for KW1, along with drums. 7:25 Hooky tests his mike
8:00 Bass for Skullcrusher
8:12 More Hooky mic tests
8:55 More bass for Skullcrusher

Review (excerpt) by Paul Bursche (Melody Maker, I think)


New Order have been known to play a mere 30 minute set, so there's none of this hanging around in the bar that greets most bands. Everyone's trying to get as near to the front as they can -- and what a mixture they are!

Hull's disco kids mingle with mohicaned punks and youths from Manchester in long macs. There are girls, there are boys, young and old. It's the sort of audience most other bands lie about having. After the success of 'Blue Monday' New Order's audience is truly universal. The group used to make a point of never playing much of their old material, but tonight we're treated to New Order's Greatest Hits. They kick off with 'Blue Monday' and then weave their way through 'Temptation', 'Ceremony', 'Everything's Gone Green' and 'Thieves Like Us'.

The band, note, actually seem happy to be playing. Lead singer Bernard Albrecht continually grins at his companions, while drummer Steve Morris practices spectacular leaps from his drum kit to the computer so he can feed in countless floppy discs. The combination of live and computer sound is particularly impressive. Everything is loud but clear.


At first the audience seem a little overawed by the occasion. It's all very well getting depressed in your own bedroom to Joy Division, but having living legends in your own backhard is something else again.

But The happy mood is catching, and by the time the band finally leave the stage, after a solid hour of thumping dance music, they leave an exhilarated, sweating throng.

Two minutes later the band troop back out to do an encore! No-one can quite believe it, but the extra track played sets the seal on what's been quite a night.

When the band finally depart, City Hall is buzzing, and outside the bootleg merchants are doing their trade in earnest. A random poll reveals most people are very pleased with their lot.

Writeup of gig

From a first-generation copy taped and made by Simon Park, using a Technics
deck. Many thanks for his contribution. Sound is very good, and the performance is AMAZING. I'm also lucky to have a different source of this, which I believe was taped by a mate of TJ's.

New Order open with _Blue___Monday_. The mic is tapped at about 0:27 on the Park tape (noted for source identification purposes) .

lyric: "If it wasn't for your misfortune, I'd be a real big bastard today."


(at the end)

BS: "Thanks a lot, you motherfuckers, we'll give you some rock n' roll now. You motherfucking fucking mothers."

(another mic tap on Park version)


At 1:45, Bernard sings "It seems like I've been here before, it seems like I've been to Hull before."

lyric: "A halo that covers my bollocks."

"Show me" bit amplified and echoed. Well at least the whoop afterwards, anyway.

Segues right into _586_, which segues into _Temptation_. Wow.

Loud cheering, and the band then get right into _Lonesome___Tonight_.

The band finally stops, and tunes up, while punters shout out. Morris pounds on his drums in the meanwhile.


BS: "Try doing the sequencer, the [word]...the tech[?]."

The beginning of the song obscures what Barney says after that, I can make out something that sounds like "Testing...".

lyric: "If i knew I didn't miss you, if i were a thousand miles from there."

Chorus is "We know we love you". There's some other differences, but is a little more solid than the one performed the night before. Left channel dropout at the 3:00 mark, for maybe about a minute...this is possibly a problem with the mic positioning, and not the tape itself.

The TJM source has a dropout at about 4:55.


BS: "Our next song is a fast one, cuz we know that most of our audience are meatheads. So is Steve!"

(Thanks Simon for the correction on the last part. The TJM version is missing Bernard's statement up to "audience".)

Bernard yells out "Don't do it!" after the first verse. Left channel cuts out before the A/B cut on the Park copy.


BS: "Just our wake-up humor."

_Thieves___Like___Us_ follow. There's a edit on the Park tape.

New Order come back on and encore with _Sunrise_. This version features "you are my brother", "I haven't seen you since you were 19", and "that's what life is like..." The TJM version should be clear enough for a transcription at some point.

NO: 19 AUG 84 Leisure Centre - Gloucester, England

Features Hooky playing the intro to _Leave___Me___Alone_ on the *wrong string*...must be heard to be believed.

To quote TJ:

> Best Hooky bass moment - has to be Leave Me Alone at Gloucester 1984. He > was playing it on the wrong string, realised and then completely lost > the plot, and it was at least a minute into the song before anyone > realised what the song was, including the rest of the band ! I'll try to > stick it up online later today.

Can be heard here:



(NME, Dave Massey)

I feel like a detective if I try to look deeply into the secret world of New Order (and their devotees).

For the cultists, it would be true to say that, for them, listening to New Order should be a private and intimate experience. A Leisure Centre is, therefore, hardly the most suitable venue in which to absorb and accept. For one thing, it's redolent of sweat and socks rather than sustaining an appreciation of the moods in the 'anonymous functionalism' that New Order purvey.

It's been said before but, like it or not, there are disconcerting parallels between New Order's current status and that of '70s era Pink Floyd. A part of them shares the Floyd's live of carefully constructed, quasi-symphonic music, full of thunder crashes and gradeur, but then the rest mixes the ingredients in a matter more attuned to the Beat than the Brain. They're all too familiar. The energetic kit or machine rhythms of Steve Morris, Gillian's blowing hot and cold keyboard stabs and sways, Hookey's bass pulses that twang or treas, and Bernie withy the vocal cries and whispers, the guitar scrabbles and syncopations.

When they fuse together on 'Procession' or 'Denial' (and 'Everything's Gone Green' on record), the effect is totally exhilarating - one of the most glorious sensations imaginable. When the pace is slowed down and the controls shifted towards drama and introspection, 'In A Lonely Place' (and 'Truth' on record) can stop you in your tracks, providing transendence to a spirtual plane. New Order can provide moments that will stay with you for the rest of your life.

They also have their debilitating cliches. I must be one of a small minority that considers 'Power Corruption And Lies' to be 50 per cent excellence and 50 per cent rubbish, and 'Temptation' and 'Confusion' to be New Order's nadir. To compete in the dancefloor stakes, New Order have to box clever and work hard to stand out from the real mix masters, and at times they don't cut it.

A couple of unrecognised numbers here have all the accoutrements of scratch, Claptraps a-go-go, and swatches of echo and reverb, but coupled with the renditions of 'Age Of Consent' and 'The Village', my reaction was little more than a fustratred 'so what?'.

With New Order, you get numerous examples of these contradictions that can confound and confuse. They even attract some adherents who might have been more at home at a football ground, and at one stage their over-eager support moved Bernie to ask them to stop pressing forward onto the peple at the front. "You see, we do care about people," quipped Bernie mischievously.

New Order are now prepared to show some of the outward emotion which has always previously been so closely guarded; precocity may slowly be replacing preciousness. My hope is that we will see and hear in the future points more towards a temptation of the senses, rather than a mere hip appeal to the instincts.

Writeup of audience recording, which is fairly clear, but runs fast.


BS: "...it all...seem excited if we screw this up..."

Some static akin to what you'd get from a VCR obscures the last part of his statement.

During intro, Bernard says something to Eddie.

BS: "Thanks very much. Thank you a lot. I'd like to say once again, thank you."

The very start of _Face___Up_ also has the VCR-type static/skipping.

Very interesting intro bit right before Hooky's bass, it's almost as if Gillian triggered the wrong thing.

Another instance of static during the first chorus, and a bit near the end.


BS: "Eh, could you do us a big favor, move back a little bit please, there's a lot of people getting hurt in the front. See, we do care about people."

Very good version of Little Dead, with the guitarwork being a highlight.


BS: "Will the people in the front please stop spitting, you won't do that at home, and everybody is at home at New Order gigs."

As noted above, Hooky starts riffing, stops, and continues, playing on the wrong string! Wow.

Lots of shouting after this one.


PH: "Do not fucking shout, it makes you want to talk...[can't make out rest]"


A long pause while the band swap instruments around, presumably.

Another bout of static near the end. And then an edit between tracks.

_Procession_ follows.

Static five seconds in.


A tape edit cuts off whatever it was that Hooky was trying to say.

About 2:49 in there's another glitch.

Someone near the taper coughs a couple of times.


Glitches at 3:14 and 3:30.

End of the main set presumably, as there's another break/edit in the tape.


Edit at end.


BS: "This one's called 'I bang my balls at Wounded Knee'. A bit forward, that."

Yet another version with scratch lyrics, mostly about Bernard's willie.

lyric: "It goes in out, it goes in out...it goes up and down..."

lyric: "You told me you didn't care about the fucking words"...


NO: 20 AUG 84 Winter Gardens - Margate

The first two and last two tracks appear on a soundboard tape (of middling quality). There's also at least one audience verison of this gig, supplied by Dave Mings.


The intro is a complete mess. Breaks down after about 25 seconds.

BS: "Erm, I'd like to dedicate this next song to, shut up, Steve (who stops drumming), Elvis Presley, who I based my entire vocal style on and who I think I look a lot like."

They start up again.

On the audience version, there's some chatter at about 0:30, and somebody having a conversation on the left channel from 1:00 to about 1:30.

At 5:40:

BS: "Andy, guitar, fluoresent light all over there, please."


Quite an impressive Hooky "yeah, yeah, yeah" grunt at 0:38.

_Dreams___Never___End_ follows.

Hard edit into _Your___Silent___Face_.

A bit of audience chatter at 2:00.

Barney mutters something after "A path we cannot take".

At the end, somebody states, "Incredibly faithful to the original."


Punter says "bass ...boot up."

Includes the extra verse that started in 1983 or so.

Interesting squeaking sounds at about 3:15-3:25.

BS: "Thanks very much."

A bit of a false start to _Chosen___Time_.

At 1:23, Barney sneaks in "slow down", probably addressed to Steve, who's drumming a mile a minute.

_The___Village_ follows.


Nothing really to note.


Abrupt edit into this on audience tape.

Some frog sounds during the intro, at about 0:30.

Ending faded out on soundboard version. Audience version fades out right when BS says "Thank you very much". A cry of "David" (or something similar) is the last thing heard.

NO: 22 AUG 84 Goldiggers - Chippenham, England

Have this on a fairly good sounding cassette. Confusion and The Perfect Kiss have brief internal cuts, however.


Has extended intro with bass synth highlights. The lyrics are close to final form.

lyrics (where they most diverge):

"We were young and I was old, you were warm and I was cold We were only three years young, our life had just begun"

I have your tune, you're out of me
Guess what we are going to see!

Oh, how I cannot bear the fucking thought of you (twice)"


"A long time now I spent my life
Living with my estranged wife
She was young and I was old
I am often being told
again and again and again and again
again and again and again and again

uno, deux, tres, quattro!"

Unique segue into _Everythings___Gone___Green_

BS: "More guitar, Ed!"

Folks sing along to the "Show

BS: "A bit more More mandolin in the PA..." (rest of his sentence dissolves into echoes/reverb.

Folks call out for Transmission and the light, there's quite a bit of shouting. Barney gets sick of it and tells sundry to "Shut up!", as the sequences for _Sooner___Than___You___Think_ begin.

This still has the "you know we love you" chorus.


Unique, memorable synth sound. Has to be heard. This is the last time New Order play this song live.


"Too hard to recall, too tough to cry
One of these days you're gonna die
And when I do, you will regret
And when I do, I will repent

A reason never was given
A reason never was given"

A few seconds of break before the Order perform _Chosen___Time_.

lyric: "Oh, sometimes they keep you waiting, look around...BASTARDS!"

A loud filter sweep covers the space between this and the next track, _Hurt_.

Barney makes some comments inserted into his lyrics...can't quite make these out, except for the four-letter words.

_Confusion_ (breakdown)

BS: "Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you very much indeed. I like (that) twat to go out, thank you very much...would you please be quiet for a minute in meditation before we start the next song. It's a very spiritual song...but I can't think of a funny title to call it at the moment."

The tempo on the opening sequencer starts out really slow, and then goes really fast, and then slow again before stopping. Folks cheer.

BS: "Why, you couldn't meditate hard enough. We can only be what you are, which is beautiful." Some guitar noodling.

BS: "So that's mine(?) probably it." Then follows an improvised drum bit, and then _Age___Of___Consent_.

My tape copy has a right channel volume drop between the 2:05-2:10 mark.

New Order play Confusion again. This may have been as an encore, because the first part of the song is cut. Would be interested in knowing if there's a full version.

Some chanting at the end I can't make out. Somebody calls out for "Ceremony". Somebody whistles "na-na-nah-nah-nah".

BS: "Will the...uh, person who threw this shoe out, if you want it back, come backstage after this and I'll give it to you."

A bit of female punter chatter, too.


This is mostly the version we know and love. The main synth line is still slightly different.

Additional information:

The following from posts in alt.music.new-order


> not sure about the rest of the band, but i think that barney had a taste for > pernod and black: i saw them at chippenham in 1984, and a guy stood next to > me at the front had bought a double to pass up to him. stories are rife > that barney got introduced to ecstatsy by the happy mondays, and indeed was > on one when they played 'fine time' live on top of the pops. recently he > has also been on prozac (self-confessed in a few interviews). however, all > this is idle speculation.

Captain Black (jeff.black@btinternet.com):

> Hey, I saw them at Chippenham GoldDiggers too. Came on to 'In a Lonely > Place' because they didn't have a fucking clue where they were and refused > to pander to the crowd by playing Blue Monday. God, I feel old ... Oh, hang > on, I am.

david fox (davidfox@totalise.co.uk):

Me too.

I remember disco lights that came down from the ceiling that you could bang your head on if you were over six foot tall. And some of the audience (only there for the disco afterwards) looking like the professional audience they used to have on top of the pops. (all in white & frizzy hair - see t.o.t.p.2).
Me, I was still looking like a sad Fergal Sharkey.

Oh and Barney was miserable, but that goes without saying really.


Dave Fox

Posted on Ceremony:

Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 08:09:19 -0400
From: "zero"
Subject: (Fac33) [transcript] -> _new_order_live__NME_sept_1_1984_

'what do i get out of this'

[transcript] -> _new_order_live__NME_sept_1_1984_

hi new order fans,

here's a nice look back into the
past at one of new orders concerts.

this one was in 1984, in england


|||| |||   |   |     |||||||||     |||||
z 3 4 0

[NOTE : this article is NOT available
on the web as far as i've researched]

[plot synopsis] -> a quick review
and thoughts about new order during
a short tour they had in 1984

new order
goldiggers, chippenham

in this age of musical compromise and halfbaked ideologies, there are still pockets
of resistance where certain groups and
individuals make their own way and as
such are landed with the responsiblity
of supporting the need for greater
commitment and relevance.

whatever theories are proposed and
dissected in relation to what new order represent (and believe me there are
enough of them), or why they still
choose a solitary approach, there can
be little doubt over their maintained
ability to simply ignore all the barbed criticism and animosity which is laid
at their door.

for one, the water eye of nostalgia is
not their way, nor meeting convention
even half way, with promises never made met. tonight's show at virgin's recently acquired goldiggers club was a
reinforcement of the positive growth
new order are making, in their own time and on their own terms.

the solemn and rarely heard 'in a lonely place' opened with typically drifting
slabs of electronic washes over that
multifarious morris drum beat: bernard
albrecht has now reaffirmed his
confidence as front man of sorts, and
altogether this was a more fathomable,
joyous group to behold.

curiously, there was only a manic, 'age of consent' from last years, "power,
corruption and lies", but more from earlier works. both 'everythings gone green', and 'hurt' illuminated new orders special
alchemy, and intoxication that at times broke away from their programmed
progressions, free-falling into a sustained rush of extraordinary effect.

but there is always room for dissent, and tonight's new songs (sorry, no titles given out) did seem overtly similar in linear construction to the old, as though this particular fascination with sequencer
charges and yearning melancholy had not been fully explored. one quite astonishing song was as much a definite blood relation to 'temptation' as '586' was to 'blue monday'.

and this surprising mini-tour of the island? for financial gain or just a testing ground for refining the new? just forget the theories; there is a vitality and gleam to this new order that will surprise many. i'd say go see them now, but the tour is already over.

still, if the band's pleasure in tonight's performance was equal to that derived from it, then they may return sooner. the days of nervous meanderings, unnerving complacency and distanced audience wind-ups are seemingly long gone

martin aston

transcription : zero
research       : zero
layout            : generic Designs
text                : textDesignersRepublic
concept        : no
thanx             : no, bs, ph, gg, sm
(c)                  : 1999 generic Designs

|||| |||   |   |     |||||||||     |||||
z 3 4 0

'i always try i always miss'

NO: 23 AUG 84 Cornwall Coliseum - St. Austell, England

Source of this recording has the first six-seven tracks starting at about a semitone too slow, but speeding up to normal by the seventh track.

Intro to _The___Perfect___Kiss_

BS: "Thank you very much. S...(?) asked me to call him up."

A punter yells "Shaddup".

Bass solo after frogs bit starts out differently. No extra verse.


Afterwards, some heavily accented voices can be heard talking about something. There's a solitary keyboard note. Someone calls out for "Transmission".


Some variations in lyrics, the most visible being the chorus.

"Oh you know how I love you. Yes you do. Oh you know how I miss you. Yes you do."

Also, there's "a thousand miles from here" and "never find" instead of "need to find", and I guess some of the particular phrasing in the LP hasn't appeared yet. Transcription of soundcheck.


lyric: "You asked me what you've seen...you said "Fuck off!"

You can hear someone ask, "When does New Order come on?" and his partner reply "I dunno.". Funny stuff.

_Thieves___Like___Us_ follows.


lyric: "People in the fucking world."

After which there's about thirty seconds of audience shoutouts.


Barney asks,

BS: "Why do women have legs?" as the bass synth sputters. Gillian hits the wrong keys at the 1:28 - 1:32 mark. At 3:30, Barney says something I can't make out to the soundman.

lyric: "If it wasn't for your big willy, I'd be a heavenly person today."


Has scratch lyrics. For an attempt at transcribing this, please see http://www.new-order.net/no/gigs/nogigs84.html#NO-840823.sunrise

Transcription of soundcheck:


The levels start out really loud, but after 3:30, they drop off again to merely loud. The first couple minutes of this are instrumental, then Barney throws in lyrics.

Somebody yells to be careful up there (or something like that).

There's about two minutes of quiet before the next song is soundchecked. Some basslines for LWTUA and the synth line for Confusion can be heard.


Only the first thirty seconds appear on tape, unfortunately.

The Perfect Kiss

This is actually the edit version from FAC321. An misattribution that may have leaked to Waterrat's listing.

Sunrise 23 Aug 84 Corwall Coliseum St. Austell

The transcription on this one is ROUGH, due to not being able to clearly hear Barney's speech. Not that the lyrics are any great work of art, mind you.

You kept me waiting for a long time tonight Your eyes are so bu... great
Tell me what...talk about you

...know...were wrong
Going in out in out
In and out and in and out
In out in out in and out

You know you always here my name
You won't mind always stuck together with...

When you are confused you could have told me What are you looking at, I don't know(?)

I have always told you that were no good But I ...cuz you're being a big fat(?) cunt

When in and out and in and out
In and out and in and out
And in and out in and out


...give you...to see
...sister...is a sin
That you are a...skies
Even if open eyes...
You were right and I was wrong
Won't you...

All the pleasure and all the pain
You can't...say you can!

You must have ... ever be
...of you...because of that you...to see One thing that we... talk
Is that...

Because we need a stinking bitch
Because we need a stinking bitch
Because... bitch
And you..

NO: 25 AUG 84 Radio 1 "Saturday Live"

Sound quality is excellent. About 30 minutes in length.

Sounds 22 Sep 84
Interview by Bill Black

http://www.new-order.net/terminal1.demon.co.uk/NewSounds9-84.htm (link is currently dead)

Helped to date their appearance on Radio 1, plus gives may details surrounding the appearance. Article also has photos taken from their session. don't have notes regarding when their "Saturday Live" was first aired.

Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 16:04:37 +0100
From: "Ally"
Subject: (Fac33) Old Q Magazine New Order article ...

I found this little extract in the January 1997 edition of Q Magazine. It was in a section called "TV Hell" which reviewed less than successful performances of bands on TV:


For New Order's appearance on BBC2's 1985 special Rock Around The Clock, the sound wasn't strictly "good", but the real problem was Bernard Sumner, merrily "speeding off his nut. He was singing badly off-key, and you could see people in the control room wincing." explains associate John Barrett. "You can hear him telling drummer Steve to speed up, even on slow songs like In A Lonely Place. In one song he changed the words to, 'I wish someone would tell me what the fuck we should do.' Typical New Order, highly entertaining."


Announcer: "...you viewers to 'Rock Around The Clock' to the semi-legendary basement studios of Saturday Live. This studio complex actually used to be used before the war as an early BBC experimental TV studio, indeed there's even a plaque on the wall that explains all the details. Today, though, we're here to hear some modern things. It's the music of New Order making their live radio debut on the telly. So, for half an hour, enjoy this music! Live on BBC2 in color, live in stereo on Radio 1, here they are, New Order."



Nothing worth noting.


PH: "This one's called Age Of Consent."

Barney's guitar into is somewhat flubbed.

At the end, Hooky says "turn down his guitar a little bit", probably referring to Bernard.


"I still find it so hard/To stay in tune with you But I'm quite sure that you'll tell me/What the fuck we should do"

Barney also comes in a bit early with his "Thought I told you to meet me..." contribution.


Hooky plays cymbals during the intro, with the pick in his mouth.

BS: "Speed up a little bit Steve, it's a bit faster than this."

(later on)

BS: "Faster!" (said about twice)

(at the end)

BS: "An atmospheric song in an unatmospheric place."


Really good version, the music stops, and Barney goes into the "Oh you got green eyes..." bit acapella, he also says (in an undertone) at the "Oh, it's the last time" line, "Yes, it is."...and of course, gets off a "last FUCKING time". And there's a funny sort of spaghetti-western bass riff at the end." Aaron Gerritz wrote in and identified this as the opening riff to "My Girl", written by Smokey Robinson. Interesting how Hooky borrows basslines from 60s-70s Motown/funk records.

The video version reveals that he rips off his headphones about halfway through the song.

And yet again, the credits roll over then ending.

BBC announcer outro

"And that was the sound of Temptation, that was New Order: Peter Hook, Stephen Morris, Gillian Gilbert, and Bernard Sumner, in their debut live Radio 1 session, I hope you enjoyed it telly as well, by the way. Tomorrow the band are playing the Portsmouth Guildhall..."

NO: 26 AUG 84 Guildhall - Portsmouth England

From: "Kevin Maidment"
Subject: Portsmouth 84

Here's a few recollections about New Order's gig in Portsmouth August 1994

I spent most of the afternoon hanging around the back of the venue attempting to listen to the soundcheck, which was fairly pointless seeing as the Guildhall is right next to the railway track (although i did get to hear Senses and The Village). It was a brilliantly sunny August day and the temperature inside the venue was like a microwave. Hot? Unbelievably so. I went in wearing a white t-shirt, stood at the front jammed against someone wearing a red t shirt and when i came out, my t-shirt was pink! I was one of two people at the front of the stage with a tape recorder in my hand. Just before "Hurt", Peter Hook wandered over and attempted to wrestle the tape machines from our hands and said "You bastards make enough money as it is". Bernard Sumner looked down and said "This one's for all you bootleggers, no bum notes, you'll make a fortune out of it". Funnily enough, earlier that day we'd asked Sumner if it was ok to record the gig and he said yes!


And added later:

From: "Kevin Maidment"
Subject: Re: Drumming in AoC (was Re: (Fac33) World In Motion remixes)

prior to _Hurt_ he said

"This one's for all you bootleggers, no bum notes, you'll make a fortune out of it" while Peter Hook attempted to wrestle the tape recorder from my friend's hands at the front of the stage .

Hands up if you are the person who ran around Portsmouth Guildhall with somebody's underpants on your head during the soundcheck because the roadie said he'd get you the bands' autographs if you did...

And from PatTeasdale:

"I met New Order and Rob Gretton when they played in Portsmouth '84 .... we got into the soundcheck, got some sleeves autographed (including by Rob, who insisted on signing it 'Love and Kisses') and New Order played instrumentals of Walked in Line and Shes Lost Control, along with New Order stuff like Sooner than you think, etc."


First version (MP3): this source tape has pretty good dynmaic range but sounds pretty muddy. Misses out on the backing PA and Barney's first statement. Actually, I have the tape original, which I surmise is an Nth gen copy from the master, but not good enough to bother with making lossless clones. Also, this version was taped down in front and has lots of audience banter.

On another tape (davemings EZT seed, taped by dc_X79), there some C&W tune on the PA, and then the Order come on, with people yelling "Here we go, here we go!". This tape is superior in quality to the MP3 version, with less down-in-frontness, so this constitutes an upgrade compared to the first version.

BS: "Thanks very much, we've not done anything yet." (not present on the MP3 version)

The first part of _Confusion_ is quite distorted. This was definitely recorded around a crowd of people who were following NO around during their '84 tour. (MP3 version)

Some girls scream about 2:00 in. Pretty good bass ending.

Amusing audience banter (MP3 version):

Guy: "Please get out of the way."

Girl: "Tell him not to push!" Whistle.

Another guy: "Tell him to stop pushing!"

Girl: "Well, he says to stop pushing...Bernie...Bernie!"

Third guy: "Oh c'mon, _______ legs....

Loud whistles and "Here we go's" (both).


Blah, right channel drops out a couple of minutes in. (MP3 version)

Girl: "Bernie, Bernie, tell him...tell him not to push, Bernie!"

lyric: "Avenues, all lined with feces...abandon me, and then you... streak..." (you can leave the rest to your imagination)

More scuffling and requests...


Fans are apparently speculating on what this is..."Perfect Kiss" "This isn't perfect kiss"...wonder if "this is the day"..."Blue Monday"

Stereo comes back. Early version drum pattern, more militaristic than the recorded version.

Comparing this version of Face Up to the first time they played it should be an interesting exercise, the lyrics slowly move closer to their final form.


Compared with:


Nice guitar work near the end.

After the song finishes up people start crying for Temptation...


After it finishes...
(MP3 version)

Girl: "They _____ it."


BS: "This set's for all you bootleggers, no bum notes on it, you'll make a fortune out of it".

(as reported by Kevin above, but wording slightly different)

The lyrics apparently carry along the theme:

BS: "I am for you will enjoy...fuck you..."

BS: "And it's time allowed to masturbate...in the commune."

'Dave Mings' (John Saunders) reports (re their performance on Saturday Live the day before:

> Yeah, August 25th 1984...the next night they played Portsmouth and I'm > sure during Hurt, Barney sings 'no more mistakes like the one yesterday' > or something like that.

BS: "Thanks very much, thank you, thank you. And I like to add to that, thank you."

Audience: "Fon-tastic. Bastard"

Bernard introduces Dave Pils.

BS: "This is Dave, our roadie, he's from Walthamstow, in London."

Folks say, "Hi Dave!" (MP3 version)

BS: "That one over there is Terry. He's our other roadie. I used to go to school with him. And the other one is just too cool to mention."

Somebody cries out, "Who are you?", repeating it once. (MP3 version)


The sounds starts going really muddy at this point on the MP3 version. The dc_X79 version doesn't have that problem.

Yet more cries for "Temptation"...will New Order play it? Stay tuned.


The speakers drown out Hooky's vocal in bass feedback...

The dc_X79 source has a bit of tape warble at about 1:20 or so.

Temptation remains a popular request. Somebody calls out for Gillian.

People start changing "New Order New Order"

Girl: "Temptation...it's a bloody football match." Then she cries for 'Ally'.

There's a cut between these songs on the dc_X79 version.


Source cuts out for a second about 5 seconds in. There's a couple more dropouts about a minute in. (MP3 version)

A tiny bit of warble on the dc_X79 version as well.

BS: "...fast a little bit, fast...". You can hear this better on dc_X79, as the MP3 version has too many people yelling for Temptation to make out anything, but what is said is still hard to make out.

Hooky says something about putting something back together again.

Somebody actually calls out for Procession.

Girl: "Give us the thing, Barney. Give us the thing, Barney." She's really annoying here. (MP3 version)


People clap along to the inital rhythm. And of course, people start singing about, including the Girl (MP3 version, of course).

The end of Blue Monday segues into _The___Perfect___Kiss_

BS: "This song is called 'A Perfect Kiss'.

One of the people there cries "They've changed the name again." (MP3) Probably a bootlegger.

One difference in the early arrangement is that Hooky plays a bass solo while Barney pounds on the cowbell. Good bass solo at the end too.

4:35-4:40 on the dc_X79 source has glitches, which have been digitally corrected by patching from elsewhere in the track.

A bit of distortion and bass feedback between tracks.


BS: "This song's for our lads who fought in the, er, Falklands... there's not many for it here, but the ones that are, for once, I agree with you."

Cut-out near the end. Wonder happened to the Girl, considering she had her knickers in a hoot over them playing this...(MP3 version). The dc_X79 version has no cuts.

Face Up 26 AUG 84 Guildhall, Portsmouth England

A long time now I've seen your face seen your face seen your face I always thought I was in disgrace tell me ___ what you were pointed to I was young and you were old your ____ cock was feeing cold Don't ____ on your knees when... (can't make out rest) Here were days when I had a ______ (sounds like 'cockpit')

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you I said Oh how I cannot bear the very thought of you

He said...oh how I cannot bear the thought of you

Knowing you like I use to do
We were young and we were pure

A long time now I've seen your face
It's always falling into disgrace

Am I a man...it often feels like that
It always feels (like) the pump to the twat

You were young and I was old
I am always being cold

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you He said Oh how I cannot bear the very thought of you

And we were young and not so pure
We went down___(?) like an open door

I said oh how I cannot bear the thought of you I said oh how I cannot bear the thoughtttttt of you...woo!

A long time now from remind(?) everything Almost blighted(?) right to be
I have forgot I ever known
They won't...but what so are we

You were young and I was old
I was always being cold

You love me and I love you
What the fuck are we gonna do?

Oh how I cannot bear the thought of you I said oh how I cannot bear the thought of you I said oh how I cannot bear the thought of you I said oh how I cannot bear the thought of you

I said Oh how I cannot bear the very thought of you

We were so young and we were so pure
We ripped our lives through the open door

Oh how I cannot bear the thouuuughtttt of you...woo!

NO: 27 AUG 84 Heaven Ultradisco - London

Tape I have is a second gen audience tape, pretty listenable! There's at least one other version too.


BS: "Would you all move back, please, people in the front now are getting crushed."

Bernard "owws" at two and a half minutes in.

EGG_ segues into _Temptation_.

_Ceremony_ falls apart after the first few seconds.

BS: "Sorry about this. The bass is out of tune. And we pretend to fucking drum, which of course it isn't, but this is an...improvised jam... Sue me, Steve."

During _Your___Silent___Face_, instead of the usual "Why don't you piss off?" BS sings "Why don't you fuck off?"

_Sooner___Thank___You___Think_, _Your___Silent___Face_, and _Thieves___Like___Us_ pass by without incident.


BS: "Gillian, turn the keyboards down a little bit, please."

punter: "Killboy!"

BS: "I agree with that".

Of course, the keyboards are still too loud, at least the bass keys are :-)

TMK recording has its A/B split at this point.

_Blue___Monday_ follows.


BS: "Very artistic, those lads are, they like it."

_Sunrise_ has completely different lyrics, including the "you were right and I was wrong" that would end up in Face Up. A difficult transcription, but I think I got most of it right.



BS: "And that's for pop pullin'. Who says, I've got no sense of humor?" (not sure if this is 100% correct)

Sunrise (Sustenance) 27 Aug 84 Heaven Ultradisco London

I've been waiting to hear your voice for a long time now We've known you since you were a pig...a cow

Here is what I'm going to do
Guess what I'm gonna do to you
That is what I wanted to do
Guess what I'm gonna do to you

It's called sustenance
Same thing

For the present hour just face it
Always tells me a total disgrace
You were right and I was wrong
From the start we here so come

I'm sure when you were a boy(?)
We were brave and we were bold
And we refused to see your lie
Buried me your tears won't dry

It's called sustenance
The only one(?)

Someone told me you came in here
All the people came in here
We were young and we were bold
Your beautiful faces shone

I was right and you were wrong
From the start you really grown
We are there to masturbate
When I come you might be gone